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fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #121 

The border war men's slowpitch game was lame. People in the stands were bored and the game became a joke very quickly and ended in run-rule very quickly. Drop the border war and have a celebrity softball game featuring former softball players (retired not active) on teams with celebs. This is entertaining to all the teams participating in the world cup as well as the fans and viewers. There are many muicians, actors, etc. that would love to get back in the spotlight for a moment. Garth brooks and reba mcEntire both grew up in oklahoma, went to college in oklahoma (oklahoma state and SE OSU) and are mega stars of the past who would still draw for a celebrity softball game during women's world cup in oklahoma city.

The men's slowpitch teams are muscular athletes but that doesn't make it an exciting and enjoyable sport to watch. At least with celebs and ex-softball players it is entertaining and fun. Watching hulk smash puny softball over the fence is not.

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JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #122 
mindajane - In no way are you being attacked. You are obviously entitled to your opinion.  Some posters simply disagree with your perspective.  No one has called you names or trashed your image.   If you want to be attacked, you will have to go to MIscellaneous and agree with Dewey.      
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Original_Coach

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Reply with quote  #123 
Congratulations to Team USA on winning The 2011 USA Cup Championship!

Cochran, May and Arioto were very good!

I was truly disappointed that Japan did not play there Front Line players they had with them in North America for the USA Cup.

Japan DID play there best players to win the 2011 Canadian Open.

There strategy is complex. They were testing and training younger players as did the USA.

The width of the strike zone drastically changes around the world in International play.

With a USA umpire behind the plate for the Championship game in OKC. It was much easier for the USA players to anticipate the strike zone.

Look at video from the Championship game in Canada. You will see a much different strike zone.

I also though overall that the umpiring was poor in OKC!

The USA,  JAPAN and CANADA all have a bright future for International Softball!!

Go EARTH SOFTBALL!

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TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #124 
How about Australia ???
They seem to have lost their touch.

fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #125 
I agree with original coach--I was disappointed that japan did not throw their ace pitcher in okc nor play some of their other players from when they beat team USA in canada right before world cup in okc. I wanted to see how team USA would respond to the challenge with the home crowd behind them.

The championship game was a letdown. Glad team USA won but the a zillion walks and two horrible calls at 3rd base took some shine off the trophy for me. In that respect I agree with mindajane. If team usa were not getting calls and walked 6 batters, walked in runs, had team japan not swinging the bat, and had runners out at 3rd but called safe and a safe runner called out when hit by the ball we would cry foul. Headlines would read "umpires walk japan to championship in world cup of softball". Outside of USA the strike zone will be more like it was in canada. International ball wants girls to swing the bat not rest it on their shoulders unless a juicy pitch is thrown to them.

Even with the 3-blind-mice the world cup this year was 1000X better than last year. 5 visiting international teams instead of 2, fresh new faces for team usa, and the invinvible aura of playing pro softballers was not there so you knew the young girls of team usa could lose...so they had to go out and win (whereas team usa in the past had to beat themselves to lose).
US playing team USA pro players is overkill in international play. Using college girls etc. makes it competitive.



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fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #126 
Worst...timing....ever..................

Women's orld cup of softball had the unluck of playing the championship at the same time that the NFL ened it's lockout. This mean ESPn interrupted shows to have non-stop coverage of NFL restarting. So sportscenter briefly recapped the MLB scores and did most of the show on the NFL ending 136 days of lockout. Not 1 mention of world cup of softball nor was it on the ticker at bottom that had scores. They even had a 5 second recap of swimming in china but nothing about softball.

And except for the few NPF that are broadcast on espn we never ever hear about those games on espn... Or the sports section of the newspaper (unless the team is local). Bowling gets more broadcasts and love.
Sometimes i think if the usa softball team were ranked like australia is and then managed to pull off a tourney win it would be sports news. People like cheering underdogs to victory. Against the odds. We have dominated in softball for so long it is only news if we lose a tourney.

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fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #127 
Australia is getting back to it's number 2 in the world form.
They finished 3rd in the world cup of softball this year but Canada will remeber being beat by Australia on sunday night and being knocked out the championship game. Announcers and stadium staff were so sure canada was going to win that they were patting usa on back for having the lowest runs against of the 3 teams that would tie for top seed and how the grand slam by arioto knocked japan out of championship. Oops...canada loses to australia and it is usa and japan as top 2. Australia needs some more pitchers is all. They could have easily beat japan too. AUssies are on the up swing.

Great Britain and Czech republic....they need help.

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CalRoxMySox44

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Reply with quote  #128 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix
Australia is getting back to it's number 2 in the world form.
They finished 3rd in the world cup of soccer this year but Canada will remeber being beat by Australia on sunday night and being knocked out the championship game. Announcers and stadium staff were so sure canada was going to win that they were patting usa on back for having the lowest runs against of the 3 teams that would tie for top seed and how the grand slam by arioto knocked japan out of championship. Oops...canada loses to australia and it is usa and japan as top 2. Australia needs some more pitchers is all. They cpould have easily beat japan too. AUssies are on the up swing.

Great Britain and Czech republic....they need help.

world cup of soccer?

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rocklifter

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Reply with quote  #129 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix

The border war men's slowpitch game was lame. People in the stands were bored and the game became a joke very quickly and ended in run-rule very quickly. Drop the border war and have a celebrity softball game featuring former softball players (retired not active) on teams with celebs. This is entertaining to all the teams participating in the world cup as well as the fans and viewers. There are many muicians, actors, etc. that would love to get back in the spotlight for a moment. Garth brooks and reba mcEntire both grew up in oklahoma, went to college in oklahoma (oklahoma state and SE OSU) and are mega stars of the past who would still draw for a celebrity softball game during women's world cup in oklahoma city.

The men's slowpitch teams are muscular athletes but that doesn't make it an exciting and enjoyable sport to watch. At least with celebs and ex-softball players it is entertaining and fun. Watching hulk smash puny softball over the fence is not.


As someone who played Slowpitch on the higher levels I find your remarks offensive. Yes, You have a right to your own opinion. Your remark reminds me of a heated discussion that went on between Lisa Fernandez and the Great Bruce Meade. Lisa had made the same old comment about Beer League ball when Bruce walked over to her and said...."Darling. Sure you can strike us men out and make yourselves feel good. The problem is comparing our two games is like comparing apples to oranges. The issue isn't whether which sport is better but rather both sports are given the respect they deserve. Someone else made a smart aleck comment about Slowpitch and he said quite directly....when you can hit a ball as far as we can...and when you can field your positions and hit for the high averages like we do.....Then and only then is when we can compare the two sports.
Like it or not Slowpitch is a good sport and to be able to play it on the Highest level is quite difficult. You dont believe me or think Im nuts. Ask Sarge, he knows who I am and who I played with.

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fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #130 

I did not say men's slowpitch was lame....I said the border war slowpitch game between usa and canada was lame. It was. We were there. Fans there were talking about how lame and boring it was. They didn't say men's slowpitch was lame---they said the borderwar canada vs USA men's slowpitch match was lame. People left to get food or take a break before the night slowpitch games. Even players who were hanging around got bored and left. It was not entertaining to watch. I would have rather watched 2 local slowpitch softball teams play than the border war. My dad played slowpitch at highest level which is what got me into softball as a kid and beyond.

NO ONE said it wasn't a sport. Synchronized swimming is sport an so is curling (ice shuffleboard with sweeping). Hunting is a sport. So is bowling, archery, skateboarding, and apparently eating hot dogs since espn covers that each year as a sport. At the highest levels of any sport it is difficult. Just because something is a sport does not mean it is entertaining to watch. And even entertaining sports have bad events.
The border was was Lame. It was called after 4 innings with the USA winning 25-3. There were 4700 people in stands for USA vs Japan final. FOr the border war they had barely 500 to start and after 2nd inning half had left. Family, friends, media, etc left to watch.
FOr the women's world cup of softball weekend replace the border war with celebrity slowpitch softball was my suggestion above. Didn't say slowpitch was lame or the men playing weren't athletes....just said the 2011 border war game was lame. It was a 25-3 batting practice.

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mindajane

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Reply with quote  #131 
I was just talking about the whole Japan not playing their top players with a friend. I told him at first I found it a bit odd that Japan's top players didn't play in the championship game. I found it odd that Ueno was there in uniform and didn't pitch a single game at the World Cup. I just knew they would pitch her in the championship game and was confused when they didn't. I'll be honest I was disapointed when I watched the game on ESPN3 and saw how many of their top players were on the bench. My friend asked how is it any different than what USA softball done? The only difference is their top players are allowed to be there and wear the uniform they just don't get to play. Isn't that was the IOC wants? Instead of international softball they want it be an international version of college softball. We can't have one team dominating or playing too well. It might be boring. So they have to water it down. After thinking about the teams that were there and their ages it didn't take me long to realize how true his words were. There were some older players there but most of them were college age(meaning between ages 18-23 or 24) or younger. I think we better get used to not seeing these countries top players. That apparently is no longer international softball.

As far as the slow pitch game most years I love it. I'll admit this year was a little boring. But I watched slow pitch long before I was introduced to fast pitch. From the time I was in diapers until I was a teenager I spent several evenings a week watching my dad play slow pitch softball. He never played at a high level but he loved it and only gave it up when his back couldn't handle it anymore. Slow pitch will always hold a special place in my heart and I would be very sad to see them get rid of the USA and Canada game!
fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #132 
This was the 3rd year for the border war (and most likely the last).  It has dropped in attendance each year and is not a tradition of the weekend like other events. Team USa and team canada playing several exhibition games against other all-star teams during world cup of softball weekend will continue. Those games are fun, enterttaining, and fan favorites. Watching rusty bumgardner and the guys against all-star teams. More of a harlem globetrotter feel to it as well as the competiton.

And yes.....seems since usa and canada had their top players sit out they must have scolded japan for using their top players in canada cup weeks ago and winning it. Probably asked them not to play them in OKC. And since team japan has not went home yet they still had the players with them. A college-ages game (once they dump stacy may johnson that is...lol).
They already have a jr. nationals team anyways.


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ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #133 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mindajane
I was just talking about the whole Japan not playing their top players with a friend. I told him at first I found it a bit odd that Japan's top players didn't play in the championship game. I found it odd that Ueno was there in uniform and didn't pitch a single game at the World Cup. I just knew they would pitch her in the championship game and was confused when they didn't. I'll be honest I was disapointed when I watched the game on ESPN3 and saw how many of their top players were on the bench. My friend asked how is it any different than what USA softball done? The only difference is their top players are allowed to be there and wear the uniform they just don't get to play. Isn't that was the IOC wants? Instead of international softball they want it be an international version of college softball. We can't have one team dominating or playing too well. It might be boring. So they have to water it down. After thinking about the teams that were there and their ages it didn't take me long to realize how true his words were. There were some older players there but most of them were college age(meaning between ages 18-23 or 24) or younger. I think we better get used to not seeing these countries top players. That apparently is no longer international softball.

As far as the slow pitch game most years I love it. I'll admit this year was a little boring. But I watched slow pitch long before I was introduced to fast pitch. From the time I was in diapers until I was a teenager I spent several evenings a week watching my dad play slow pitch softball. He never played at a high level but he loved it and only gave it up when his back couldn't handle it anymore. Slow pitch will always hold a special place in my heart and I would be very sad to see them get rid of the USA and Canada game!

I wish you would stop saying that the players who left were not allowed to be there. They chose to leave. They are no longer on the team so they can't be there. They left for economical reasons. If USA softball still had the funds to pay them what they were paid in the past they would still be there. That is why you will see mostly college age players on the national teams now.


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ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #134 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix
This was the 3rd year for the border war (and most likely the last).  It has dropped in attendance each year and is not a tradition of the weekend like other events. Team USa and team canada playing several exhibition games against other all-star teams during world cup of softball weekend will continue. Those games are fun, enterttaining, and fan favorites. Watching rusty bumgardner and the guys against all-star teams. More of a harlem globetrotter feel to it as well as the competiton.

And yes.....seems since usa and canada had their top players sit out they must have scolded japan for using their top players in canada cup weeks ago and winning it. Probably asked them not to play them in OKC. And since team japan has not went home yet they still had the players with them. A college-ages game (once they dump stacy may johnson that is...lol).
They already have a jr. nationals team anyways.

I'll wager you will see the top players for Japan playing for the World Championship next year.

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toroman

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Reply with quote  #135 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rocklifter
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix

The border war men's slowpitch game was lame. People in the stands were bored and the game became a joke very quickly and ended in run-rule very quickly. Drop the border war and have a celebrity softball game featuring former softball players (retired not active) on teams with celebs. This is entertaining to all the teams participating in the world cup as well as the fans and viewers. There are many muicians, actors, etc. that would love to get back in the spotlight for a moment. Garth brooks and reba mcEntire both grew up in oklahoma, went to college in oklahoma (oklahoma state and SE OSU) and are mega stars of the past who would still draw for a celebrity softball game during women's world cup in oklahoma city.

The men's slowpitch teams are muscular athletes but that doesn't make it an exciting and enjoyable sport to watch. At least with celebs and ex-softball players it is entertaining and fun. Watching hulk smash puny softball over the fence is not.



As someone who played Slowpitch on the higher levels I find your remarks offensive. Yes, You have a right to your own opinion. Your remark reminds me of a heated discussion that went on between Lisa Fernandez and the Great Bruce Meade. Lisa had made the same old comment about Beer League ball when Bruce walked over to her and said...."Darling. Sure you can strike us men out and make yourselves feel good. The problem is comparing our two games is like comparing apples to oranges. The issue isn't whether which sport is better but rather both sports are given the respect they deserve. Someone else made a smart aleck comment about Slowpitch and he said quite directly....when you can hit a ball as far as we can...and when you can field your positions and hit for the high averages like we do.....Then and only then is when we can compare the two sports.
Like it or not Slowpitch is a good sport and to be able to play it on the Highest level is quite difficult. You dont believe me or think Im nuts. Ask Sarge, he knows who I am and who I played with.

Playing any sport at a high level takes dedication training and focus.  Slow pitch softball requires skill of hitting the ball and fielding the ball just like Fastpitch, but it is a different game.  My daughters started out playing slowpitch (most every kid hit thus everyplay required a defensive play) I believe that slowpitch developed their defensive skills to transition into fastpitch. 
But any sport can be played at a high level.  it doesnt matter if it is bowling volleyball basketball or even football.  Most any given saturday there is league football game in our town.  That doesnt detract from the high level of play in the pros. Likewise any given day of the week there is a slow pitch game at a local park, that doesn't detract from the high level of play of the National Team players.  They still deserve the respect of high level athletes.  Just like I don't watch soccer (which my some call cross country with a ball) I still appreciate the high level of athlete in the game.

I must say I have to agree with Rocklifter on this one.
ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #136 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ProudDad
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix
This was the 3rd year for the border war (and most likely the last).  It has dropped in attendance each year and is not a tradition of the weekend like other events. Team USa and team canada playing several exhibition games against other all-star teams during world cup of softball weekend will continue. Those games are fun, enterttaining, and fan favorites. Watching rusty bumgardner and the guys against all-star teams. More of a harlem globetrotter feel to it as well as the competiton.

And yes.....seems since usa and canada had their top players sit out they must have scolded japan for using their top players in canada cup weeks ago and winning it. Probably asked them not to play them in OKC. And since team japan has not went home yet they still had the players with them. A college-ages game (once they dump stacy may johnson that is...lol).
They already have a jr. nationals team anyways.

I'll wager you will see the top players for Japan playing for the World Championship next year.

EDIT:
Japan started 4 of the first five hitters from the Canada Cup in the World Cup championship with another 3 players coming in later in the game or pinch hitting. As for pitching Team USA used 3 of their four pitchers in Canada and the USA. It was hardly their B team when their top hitters started and finished the game.

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Laffy

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Reply with quote  #137 
International softball... ITS A CONSPIRACY!

The internet lacks a facepalm picture sufficient enough to describe some of the posts in here right now...

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ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #138 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laffy
International softball... ITS A CONSPIRACY!

The internet lacks a facepalm picture sufficient enough to describe some of the posts in here right now...

Here are the links to the box scores for each game.

http://fastpitch.bbstats.pointstreak.com/flash/index.html?gameid=53078

http://www.cstv.com/gametracker/launch/gt_wsoftbl.html?event=1019560&school=fo&sport=wsoftbl&camefrom=&startschool=&

http://www.usasoftball.com/events.asp?uid=6375
Does that help?


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tenfour

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Reply with quote  #139 
A few comments.  I am not a slowpitch fan. I find it boring. However, many do find it enjoyable and that is okay by me.
In my opinion the reason there is a "border war" game (slow-pitch) in OKC is because many of the ASA Commissioners have a number of slow-pitch teams in their regions and have pressured the ASA National office to ensure there is slow-pitch representation in the WCS.

The ASA is very poor at promoting any tournaments they are involved with. When the ASA Major tournaments were the King/Queen of Tournaments, the ASA just opened their doors and in flocked the teams followed by their fans.
When the competition became serious (ISC Men's) the ASA solution was to ban players/teams who competed in the ISC Touraments.

This was a year (2011) when there should have been major promotion about the World Cup of Softball because of the major changes in the make-up of the National Team.
The ASA response appears to have been similar to the ostrich. 
A like-minded response was used in dealing with (or not) the Premier Tournament which is more than a worthy competitor to the ASA 18Gold. 

The ASA is so out of touch with promoting their product (softball) because they fail to use the tools that are available to them.  How many articles directly from the ASA has appeared on UCS?  
The ASA would be right at home in Washington. Do nothing but strive to maintain the status quo. Even at this, the ASA is a failure.

I disagree that Australia is 'getting back to its #2 world form'. Australia is facing an uphill battle now because of what they did not do 15 years earlier.
When they were awarded the 2000 Olympics, Australia Softball had so much money available and yet they wasted it on what was less important.
Some of this money should have been spent on developing/training Australian coaches for softball and identifying and training future players. Instead they chose to bring in New Zealand coaches and spend, spend, spend almost exclusively on their national women's team.
Australia does not have a college program similar to the USA and so it was/is critical that they develop those future players.  Now that the Olympic money is no longer available much of their player development is left to Japan, European countries, and the USA colleges to oversee.
I believe many of the future elite female athletes in Australia will not be competing in softball but will  instead be directed to those sports that are in the Olympic program.

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Laffy

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Reply with quote  #140 


Pretty much the same Japan team played the USA in the finals of the World Cup that played in the finals of the Canadian Cup minus an injured Ueno...

Honestly I think it is more of an issue of some people refusing to let go of the past. The thought that Mendoza, Watley, Finch, Abbott, Osterman, Bustos, and co. could ever be replaced in the Red, White, and Blue seems to be blasphemy to some... Finch and the Super Friends will always be remembered for how much they revolutionized softball, but softball as a whole in the USA is just so strong and so deep that ultimately you can take a roster of college all stars and put them out against the best of the rest of the world, those college all stars from the good 'ole USA are going to continue the proud winning tradition.

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JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #141 
OC - "Pretty much the same team that played for Japan against the USA in the Canada Cup final played against USA in the World Cup final minus Ueno (granted a big minus)".  Why would you make a point of diminishing USA's victory in the final at Okie City by, in effect, saying they played the Japanese Junior Varsity Team?  On the one hand, you congratulate them, and on the other you diminish the victory earned by Team USA.  Also, the strike zones might have been different (I don't know but they usually are from umpire to umpire), but Team USA's approach in Okie City was to lay off the pitches four to six inches east and west on the plate, and it paid off with walks and 3-2 counts.       

 I grant you that without Ueno Japan is not as good a team as with her, but she was injured and couldn't pitch.  Injuries are simply part of the game as one can see from Molly Johnson's  and Jenae Leles's injuries.  All I'm saying is that credit should be given where credit is due, both to coaching staffs and players and nothing should be done to diminish their accomplishments.  I do agree with what you wrote about the futures of several national teams with young players.  
 

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"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
rocklifter

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Reply with quote  #142 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tenfour
A few comments.  I am not a slowpitch fan. I find it boring. However, many do find it enjoyable and that is okay by me.
In my opinion the reason there is a "border war" game (slow-pitch) in OKC is because many of the ASA Commissioners have a number of slow-pitch teams in their regions and have pressured the ASA National office to ensure there is slow-pitch representation in the WCS.

The ASA is very poor at promoting any tournaments they are involved with. When the ASA Major tournaments were the King/Queen of Tournaments, the ASA just opened their doors and in flocked the teams followed by their fans.
When the competition became serious (ISC Men's) the ASA solution was to ban players/teams who competed in the ISC Touraments.

This was a year (2011) when there should have been major promotion about the World Cup of Softball because of the major changes in the make-up of the National Team.
The ASA response appears to have been similar to the ostrich. 
A like-minded response was used in dealing with (or not) the Premier Tournament which is more than a worthy competitor to the ASA 18Gold. 

The ASA is so out of touch with promoting their product (softball) because they fail to use the tools that are available to them.  How many articles directly from the ASA has appeared on UCS?  
The ASA would be right at home in Washington. Do nothing but strive to maintain the status quo. Even at this, the ASA is a failure.

I disagree that Australia is 'getting back to its #2 world form'. Australia is facing an uphill battle now because of what they did not do 15 years earlier.
When they were awarded the 2000 Olympics, Australia Softball had so much money available and yet they wasted it on what was less important.
Some of this money should have been spent on developing/training Australian coaches for softball and identifying and training future players. Instead they chose to bring in New Zealand coaches and spend, spend, spend almost exclusively on their national women's team.
Australia does not have a college program similar to the USA and so it was/is critical that they develop those future players.  Now that the Olympic money is no longer available much of their player development is left to Japan, European countries, and the USA colleges to oversee.
I believe many of the future elite female athletes in Australia will not be competing in softball but will  instead be directed to those sports that are in the Olympic program.


Ten,
I appreciate your comments. I was actually surprised that ASA even promotes Mens Slowpitch Due to the amount of lawsuits against them in regards to bats, rules, etc. It became a fiasco to play Mens ASA back in the 80's and 90's. Truth be known I would wager there are few if any Mens Major Tourneys in ASA anymore.
So to see them some what promote The Border Wars was a little weird.
Good thing is I got to see some of the guys I played with years ago. God Im old...

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Original_Coach

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Reply with quote  #143 
Joisey,

I would like to respectfully ask you where I diminished Team USA's performance with any of my comments?

I do my due diligence with my research and experiences with the International Game.

The biggest change from Canada to OKC by the Japanese that I saw was there use of Ueno and Mine in the Championship Games.

Yes, Ueno is a HUGE change/difference! And i was told by a Japanese player that Ueno's reason for not pitching in OKC had nothing to do with an injury.

She hit and pitched injury free in Surrey.

I think we will see a great deal of Ueno next summer in Whitehorse if she still wants to play and pitch.

I personally believe that the Japanese held Ueno out for competitive reasons.

I believe everything to be factual and true in my post.

I congratulated Team USA for winning the USA Cup.

I gave top performers credit.

I will add here that I believe that the Coaching staff from Team USA did a great job in leading our new National Team in 2011.

I will be blunt. I think your post wreaks of Nationalism and relationship sensitivity.

I honor ALL who play and coach the International Game! Not just Americans!

I think that bothers some!

And I am a proud American.

I hope you are happy and well!

OC



Congratulations to Team USA on winning The 2011 USA Cup Championship!

Cochran, May and Arioto were very good!

I was truly disappointed that Japan did not play there Front Line players they had with them in North America for the USA Cup.

Japan DID play there best players to win the 2011 Canadian Open.

There strategy is complex. They were testing and training younger players as did the USA.

The width of the strike zone drastically changes around the world in International play.

With a USA umpire behind the plate for the Championship game in OKC. It was much easier for the USA players to anticipate the strike zone.

Look at video from the Championship game in Canada. You will see a much different strike zone.

I also though overall that the umpiring was poor in OKC!

The USA,  JAPAN and CANADA all have a bright future for International Softball!!


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Original_Coach

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Reply with quote  #144 
Quick question to add.

If the NPF staggered there summer season as does the Japanese Professional League to NOT conflict with major International Softball events.

Do you think that all of the players who went to play in the NPF would still be playing for Team USA and Team Canada?  

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fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #145 
Some of the women that play in npf also play in the japanese leagues. The npf schedule as is lets players do both. However---The pan am games are oct. 17-23. NPF finishes up at the end of august. No schedule conflict--just finances (which the college kids can handle since they can't get paid or they lose egibility). Is the door open for more players to tryout for team or is the 2011 roster set? If open how many, if any, will try out for the team then.

We all remember the japan cup was cancelled this year due to the disaster the country is recovering from but will be back in 2012...so we will have japan cup, canada cup and world cup in OKC next year during the summer and during NPF season. This means if someone came back for pan am games in 2011 they would leave the team again for all 3 cups next year.

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fhoenix

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Reply with quote  #146 

I agree with coach about Ueno. She was dominant in canada cup and japan had at least 4 shut out including usa twice, australia and canada. She is as important to success of japan in a big game as lisa fernandez was for the USA in her day. 1 great pitcher in a tourney does make a difference as we all know. The team usa eagles had 3 hits and 10 strikeout against her in the 7-0 loss to japan in canada cup championship.

Ueno beat the superstar team usa for 2008 olympic gold medal. She also beat them in 2005 world cup of softball in okc and gave usa their only loss in 2006. She throws a fastball just over 75 mph (zoom) and was the only pitcher in the past 6 years that worried the mighty USA since she could shut them down. "She's a bad mutha--shut yo mouth, I'm just talkin' about Ueno...ok we can dig it".

With Ueno they can compete with top tier (like in canada cup)...without they need luck (in OKC world cup they beat canada in extra innings and beat australia in extra innings...everyone beat up czech republic and great britain so those don't matter...and they lost to usa twice). And to get to first place game monday they had to have Australia upset canada sunday night when the announcers were already bragging about how with the 3-way tie usa and canada had lowest runs-against totals and japan's was way high and would keep them out of first place game.
Ueno makes a huge difference for a team that's signature is defense and doesn't score alot.

This doesn't diminish the USA victory. The young usa team deserves credit for all their wins. It is just stating tidbits of info as a fan of international softball as a whole (seeing many a game while in australia, japan, etc)
Go team USA!

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ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #147 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix

I agree with coach about Ueno. She was dominant in canada cup and japan had at least 4 shut out including usa twice, australia and canada. She is as important to success of japan in a big game as lisa fernandez was for the USA in her day. 1 great pitcher in a tourney does make a difference as we all know. The team usa eagles had 3 hits and 10 strikeout against her in the 7-0 loss to japan in canada cup championship.

Ueno beat the superstar team usa for 2008 olympic gold medal. She also beat them in 2005 world cup of softball in okc and gave usa their only loss in 2006. She throws a fastball just over 75 mph (zoom) and was the only pitcher in the past 6 years that worried the mighty USA since she could shut them down. "She's a bad mutha--shut yo mouth, I'm just talkin' about Ueno...ok we can dig it".

With Ueno they can compete with top tier (like in canada cup)...without they need luck (in OKC world cup they beat canada in extra innings and beat australia in extra innings...everyone beat up czech republic and great britain so those don't matter...and they lost to usa twice). And to get to first place game monday they had to have Australia upset canada sunday night when the announcers were already bragging about how with the 3-way tie usa and canada had lowest runs-against totals and japan's was way high and would keep them out of first place game.
Ueno makes a huge difference for a team that's signature is defense and doesn't score alot.

This doesn't diminish the USA victory. The young usa team deserves credit for all their wins. It is just stating tidbits of info as a fan of international softball as a whole (seeing many a game while in australia, japan, etc)
Go team USA!

Ueno only shut the USA out once in Canada, the championship game. The other game ship pitched against Team USA she was pulled after 4 innings giving up 1 earned run. Japan won the game 4-3.


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ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #148 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Original_Coach
Quick question to add.

If the NPF staggered there summer season as does the Japanese Professional League to NOT conflict with major International Softball events.

Do you think that all of the players who went to play in the NPF would still be playing for Team USA and Team Canada?  

No.


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JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #149 
OC - With the one line that suggested that Japan did not play their front line players in the final of the World Cup in my mind you took away the effect of your congratulations.  To me that would be like someone congratulating the Japanese Team for their win in the Canada Cup final and then denigrating Japan's 7-0 victory by saying, "Oh well, they only played a bunch of college kids without Osterman and Abbott".  As I noted, and you well know, Ueno makes a huge difference for Team Japan, but she was injured.  Another poster noted that Japan's lineup was basically the same one that won the Canada Cup, minus Ueno. If you had said, "I (me too) would have liked to have seen Ueno in the final, but she was injured in Canada", I would have no problem with that (you and I differ about her injury as we have received our information from two different sources, probably equally informed).  I do think that to intimate that Japan played an inferior team otherwise is to take away from the glory of the USA win in Okie City.  Of course I respect your expertise, but I don't think you came across on that line as you meant to.  At least that's my view.  

PS - Yes, my post "reeks" (wrong word I think unless you think that a world perspective also "reeks" with a different view) with nationalism and relationship sensitivity.   Though I view games and tournaments with technical objectivity, I am influenced in the reporting of such with national and emotional relationship perspective to some degree, always will be.  By the way, I really like your term "relationship sensitivity" as opposed to "emotional bias".    Good stuff !!  I wish you good health and much happiness.    Frank

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ProudDad

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Reply with quote  #150 
OC - I've looked at the box scores for Canada and the USA for the Championship games between Japan and the USA. Here is what I've found:
  • 7 of the 12 players for Japan played in both games. 6 of the 9 started
  • They batted 8/23 in Canada and 4/18 in the USA
  • The players who did not play in the USA were 2/9 in Canada with 2 rbi's
  • The players who played in their place were 0/8 with a sb and an rbi
Not a great deal of difference - It was the pitching that changed the most.

I ask you this, the decision to not pitch Ueno could have been made so that one the USA would not get another look at her before Whitehorse and two so that she would not get roughed up with a smaller strike zone. Do you agree? This helps to preserve her status when facing team USA. The two teams have faced each other 6 times with three wins a piece.Team USA defeated their number two pitcher and Japan pulled Ueno early in Canada.

Don't you think that with Japan getting beaten when they throw their 2-3-4 pitchers against team USA that this proves team USA as it stands is competitive with Japan and Japan is not dominating?

Now if Team USA did not play Osterman, Abbott, Watley, Mendoza, Lowe and Duran. If they were battling injuries in two key positions unlike Japan. If they were facing Japan's best who have played together for years versus USA playing their younger players together for weeks. Wouldn't that mean that team USA while being at a disadvantage played them pretty even in splitting the Championships? Winning both in the US and losing 3 of 4 in Canada though two being by a single run.

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