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Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #61 
As you can see Bundy is not an isolated case in how BLM has handled the western lands.

http://www.kolotv.com/home/headlines/Nevada_Tribal_Leader_81_Sues_BLM_for_30M_126455343.html


RENO, Nev. (AP) - The federal government seized Raymond Yowell's cattle - all 132 head - and hauled them across the state and sold them at auction.

Then the U.S. Bureau of Land Management sent Yowell a bill for $180,000 for back grazing fees and penalties, and later garnished part of his Social Security benefits.

Now, nearly a decade later, the 81-year-old former chief of the Western Shoshone National Council is fighting back. He's suing the U.S. Bureau of Land Management, the Treasury Department and others for $30 million. Yowell claims the government violated his
constitutional rights, broke an 1863 treaty and saddled him with a debt that he doesn't owe.

"There's no other way," said Yowell, a member of the Te-Moak Band of Western Shoshone, who still works a small cattle ranch with his son in northeast Nevada's high desert.

"I kept writing letters to them saying I didn't have a debt with them, that I never signed a contract," he told The Associated Press. "But they just ignored it. There's no use talking to them."

Yowell said in the lawsuit filed earlier this month he was exercising his "treaty guaranteed vested rights" to be a herdsman when he turned his cattle out in May 2002 to graze on the historic ranges of the South Fork Indian Reservation.

BLM officials said the tribe's Te-Moak Livestock Association held a federal permit to graze cattle on the public land in northeast Nevada from 1940 to 1984, but had quit paying the fees to the BLM in 1984, claiming the tribe held title to the land.

Despite earlier federal and U.S. Supreme Court decisions against them, the Indian leaders asserted then - as Yowell does today - that the land is still theirs as dictated by the Treaty of Ruby Valley of 1863.

Under the treaty, the United States formally recognized Western Shoshone rights to some 60 million acres stretching across Nevada, Idaho, Utah and California. But the Supreme Court's 1979 ruling determined the treaty gave the U.S. government trusteeship over tribal lands, and that it could claim them as "public" or federal lands.

A related court battle continues over the legality of the Western Shoshone Claims Distribution Act of 2004 that directed more than $145 million be awarded to tribe members in exchange for relinquishing any claims to the land - a matter that has divided the estimated 10,000 remaining Western Shoshone people.

BLM officials said at the time of the seizure of Yowell's cattle that the Te-Moak livestock association owed about $2.5 million in unpaid grazing fees and fines. They said Yowell's share of the debt was $180,000.

Nearly 10 years later, Elko lawyer Julie Cavanaugh-Bill wasn't surprised to hear that Yowell made the eight-hour round trip to Reno earlier this summer to gather the forms he'd need to act as his own attorney and file his 15-page civil complaint in U.S. District Court.

Cavanaugh-Bill is married to a cousin of Yowell's. She met Yowell when she started working for the Western Shoshone Defense Project, an organization formed by the tribe's national council in 1991 to help protect its cultural and spiritual traditions on a host of legal fronts, from challenging mining projects to fighting plans for a nuclear waste dump at Yucca Mountain.

"He's got as much spunk as when I first met him," said Cavanaugh-Bill. "He is a very wise, intelligent, well-spoken individual who has an incredible knowledge about the history of the Western Shoshone people, but also the history of land issues and treaty issues."

In his lawsuit filed July 20, Yowell accuses the government of violating his right to due process, his civil rights and his constitutional protections against unwarranted seizure of property when BLM seized his cattle on May 24, 2002.

He said he's refused to pay the money because he wasn't given an opportunity to explain why he believes he doesn't need a permit to graze his cattle on "historic grazing grounds."

"I looked at it as an illegal seizure," Yowell told AP. "They took cattle without a court order. Now they are taking from my Social Security check."

Since April 1, 2008, the U.S. Treasury Department has been garnishing 15 percent of his Social Security check at the direction of the BLM.

"I'm supposed to get about $900 a month," Yowell said, "but I'm only getting $779 because they take $137."

BLM spokesman Doran Sanchez said agency lawyers had not had a chance to review Yowell's lawsuit and had no comment.

The seizure of Yowell's cattle nearly 10 years ago came as the BLM and U.S. Forest Service were stepping up enforcement of grazing regulations as drought conditions lingered across Nevada and much of the West.

"There was a lot of turmoil then. The feds were being very aggressive," recalls Janine Hansen, a national committeewoman for the Independent American Party who worked with Yowell as fellow members of the Nevada Committee for Full Statehood.

The statehood committee, a strident property rights group that refuses to recognize federal jurisdiction of land in Nevada, was at the forefront of an unconventional anti-federal alliance that united conservative ranchers, Western Shoshones and even leaders of the American Indian Movement.

Yowell retired in 2006 after nearly 30 years as chief of the national council. He said he leaves most of the heavy lifting to his son these days at his ranch on the edge of the Ruby Mountains where his parents first settled in the 1930s. He said he doesn't know if he has a chance to prevail in his case that will pit him against Justice Department lawyers.

"We'll see," Yowell said.

Hansen wishes him luck, but "the odds are so overwhelming."

"That's the problem with David and Goliath," she said. "David never wins."

 

__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #62 
http://articles.latimes.com/1991-09-25/news/mn-2569_1_western-shoshone


U.S.-Shoshone Deal Ends Threat of Federal Roundup of Livestock

September 25, 1991| Associated Press
 
 

RENO — The Western Shoshone Nation and the federal government reached a compromise Tuesday, ending plans for a federal roundup this year of excess livestock around two Shoshone sisters' remote ranch.

"The Bureau of Land Management and the Shoshone people have a common concern that the land be protected," Western Shoshone National Council Chief Raymond Yowell said.

[pixel]

Yowell met with Nevada BLM Director Bill Templeton over the bureau's insistence that sisters Mary and Carrie Dann trim their herd of more than 1,100 cattle and horses to fewer than 200.

While no numbers have been agreed to, both sides said the herd will be reduced between now and the beginning of next spring's grazing season in March.

Templeton also said the Western Shoshone will be responsible for policing the amount of livestock on public land around the Dann ranch.

"I believe we can deal with the nation and achieve mutual goals," he said.

The BLM had opened bids on Monday for a roundup of excess livestock if a compromise was not reached. The Dann sisters and other members of the Western Shoshone Nation had threatened to turn out in a show of civil disobedience if the BLM tried to round up the livestock.


__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #63 
Now that this has been dropped by the MSM more comes out about the BLM Utah division chief and how he got there. Seems the tactics used by BLM were just a progression of their culture.



http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/58394443-78/blm-love-utah-law.html.csp



http://graphics.latimes.com/utah-sting/

__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #64 
More from the BLM

They are trying to seize a working gold mine that predates the existence of the federal agency.


For the past several years, the miners from the Galice Mining District, about 30 minutes west of Grants Pass, Oregon, have been arguing over who has the rights to the minerals in the ground  around Galice Creek.  The Galice mining district is compiled of a number of claims, owners and miners and has been in continuous operation since the early 1870’s, which makes it one of the longest running operations in the US.  This specific operation predates the BLM bureaucracy by many decades in fact.

The area in question has produced in excess of 10 million ounces of gold since its conception, and geologists estimate that only 10% of the gold in the ground has been removed, which makes this area highly sought after by any standard.  It is said that children find gold with their hands in the creeks to this day.

BLM has made several attempts to disband the operation  of the sugar pine mine through multiple unsubstantiated stop orders and now a cease and desist order.  The owners of this mine have spend tens of thousands of dollars to date requesting documents, researching the claims of the BLM,and preliminary attorney fees.  The sugar pine has made requests to produce the official rulings that show they are in violation which have gone unanswered.  They simple reason given by the BLM is that “they say so”.  The BLM claims that the mine has no surface rights to the area and in turn says that all structures and equipment need to be removed. The BLM also claims that this violation is grounds for the operation to cease and tunnels filled in.  The mine predates more recent rulings about surface rights so the sugar pine feels that the new ruling is not applicable to this specific situation.

Late last week, BLM officials accompanied by Josephine County Sheriff deputies issues a cease and desist order to the district without any official ruling by the courts.  Specifically, the issue is not even scheduled to be heard in court until later in the year.  The order has given the mine until April 25th to remove all equipment, buildings and supplies from the location.  Local BLM officials have threatened to burn the buildings down if they are not removed by the date.

The owners of the sugar pine have stated that they will fully disobey the order as they claim that it is illegal and invalid.  A call for assistance to the Oath Keeper’s has been made and there is no intention to leave the area by the deadline.

This issue has far reaching implications.  The outcome from this issue and the court ruling to come will effect all of America.  The issue at hand is not just about the Galice Miners and the gold in the ground, but more about what the government says you can do with the ground in your control.  These miners have the rights to the minerals in the ground and the government wants that changed.  What comes next could effect every American.  What if your backyard has a specific mineral that the government values.  By any means,  can come in and tell you that you can not grow your broccoli on your land because it absorbs this “special” mineral?  The bigger picture would effect farmers.  What if  gold, oil, or something like uranium was found under a farmer’s corn crop.  Does the government have the right to those minerals and have the ability to over ride your use of your own land?  This issue will have the ability dictate the future use of our public and private lands.




__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


Lost_1

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Posts: 2,907
Reply with quote  #65 
Introducing Operation Jade Helm   -   KIR coming to a foxhole near you.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3013900/Fears-martial-law-special-ops-set-swarm-Southwest-operate-undetected-civilians-ve-deemed-HOSTILE-massive-military-exercise.html

Special forces set to swarm Southwest and operate undetected among civilians in massive military exercise

  • Operation Jade Helm will see 1,200 service members including Green Berets and SEALs and special forces from the Air Force and Marines in July
  • Soldiers armed with blank rounds will operate in and around towns in Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, California, Nevada, Utah and Colorado for 8 weeks
  • The so-called Realistic Military Training has some residents fearful the drill is a preparation for martial law


Seven Southwestern states will soon be infiltrated by 1,200 military special ops personnel as part of a controversial domestic military training in which some of the elite soldiers will operate undetected among civilians.

Operation Jade Helm begins in July and will last for eight weeks. Soldiers will operate in and around towns in Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, California, Nevada, Utah and Colorado where some of them wil drop from planes while carrying weapons loaded with blanks in what military officials have dubbed Realistic Military Training.

But with residents of the entire states of Texas and Utah dubbed 'hostile' for the purposes of the exercises, Jade Helm has some concerned the drills are too realistic.

The Houston Chronicle reports that, among the planned exercises, soldiers will attempt to operate undetected among civilian populations.

Residents, in turn, will be asked to report suspicious activity in order to gauge the effectiveness of the soldiers.

Military officials say they've gotten the go ahead for the operations from local authorities such as mayors and county commissions. 

And sheriff's deputies told the Houston Chronicle they would ensure residents living near where aircraft were slated to create disturbances and drop soldiers, civilian and military vehicles will barrel through and where blank rounds would be fired.

Jim Stewart with the Brazos County, Texas Sheriff's Office told the Chronicle that such exercises are far from anything new. 

'Special ops for years have trained off-post for years, where they go out and have folks that are role players out on the economy,' said the Army intelligence veteran. 'They'll have a scenario they'll be following and they'll interact with these role players as if they're in another country.'

However, the U.S. Army Special Operations Command themselves say Jade Helm is different.





__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


DietCoke

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Reply with quote  #66 
And did your WalMart store close on Monday?  [eek]
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"The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists."

-- Hannah Arendt, “The Origins of Totalitarianism” (1951)

keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #67 
I don't shop Walmart. You asking lost1? My Academy [Sports and Outdoors] has it's ammo fully stocked
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #68 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DietCoke
And did your WalMart store close on Monday?  [eek]



Don't know, but one did close in Tulsa. I think the "plumbing" problem may be keeping their crap in the store, judging by location and altercations in the parking lot that make it on the local news.




__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #69 
Diet watered-down coke works at Walmart and is looking for a new greeter job, she flushed too many tampons and clogged the plumbing at her home store. I don't think she's the type for an Oklahoma store but anything you can do to help her would be appreciated
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
Lost_1

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Posts: 2,907
Reply with quote  #70 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal
I don't shop Walmart. You asking lost1? My Academy [Sports and Outdoors] has it's ammo fully stocked



I have a couple thousand 12ga loaded up, but they will have to be pretty close for the 8 shot in the skeet loads.

__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


keepinitreal

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Posts: 25,104
Reply with quote  #71 
I alternate slugs with buckshot in my 12 and 20 gauge around the house. Going varmint hunting this weekend with a .243 and a 308, hope to dwindle the hog and coyote population. Obama's 2nd election I probably overdid it on my ammo stash.
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
DietCoke

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Reply with quote  #72 
Look it up, kir.  All part of the big government takeover.
__________________
"The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists."

-- Hannah Arendt, “The Origins of Totalitarianism” (1951)

Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #73 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DietCoke
Look it up, kir.  All part of the big government takeover.



My post was tongue in check with JG foxhole comment. Not a conspiracy theorists, but some of the things the government does makes you raise an eyebrow.

__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #74 
Don't explain anything to DC, it's almost like conversing with dinger. I caught the foxhole comment, you never know. Tin foil hat size 7 1/2 here
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
DietCoke

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Posts: 2,223
Reply with quote  #75 
Texans, you are safe.  Sleep soundly.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2015/05/02/403865824/texas-governor-deploys-state-guard-to-stave-off-obama-takeover

__________________
"The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists."

-- Hannah Arendt, “The Origins of Totalitarianism” (1951)

keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #76 
we always sleep soundly here.

your blood pressure must be better since you started lactating, relieved the pressure 

__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
Lost_1

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Posts: 2,907
Reply with quote  #77 
http://thefreethoughtproject.com/video-catches-bureau-land-management-employees-brag-stealing-land-wwii-vets/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Traffic+Driver&utm_campaign=Facebook+Stout










Full video:



__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #78 
Since it is related Lost,does anyone want to weigh in on trump's views on eminent domain?
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
PDad

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Reply with quote  #79 
Trump's views on eminent domain are to be expected since he's a developer. Here's an article for anyone unfamiliar with them - http://www.nationalreview.com/article/425212/donald-trump-eminent-domain-wonderful.
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #80 
Thanks for the doing the legwork for the low infos.  He seems more and more what I resent in a person seeking office.  A developer who wants to control the BLM, a developer who has experience in stealing land.  That is why I brought it up and my BLM is not blacklivesmatter.  Trump can be substituted for those land grabbers in Lost1's videos.

From your link

"But the second ad, spotlighting Trump’s view on eminent domain, strikes me as a potential serious weakness for Trump, as it’s just about impossible to square Trump’s view on the issue with conservatism, limited government, or, ahem, freedom and liberty. Has any Trump fan articulated an argument in favor of state and local governments claiming private property and turning it over to wealthy developers? Isn’t that just about the clearest case of big government run amok and crony capitalism?

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/424041/club-growth-action-ad-hits-trump-eminent-domain-jim-geraghty"

Check Cruz's history and his verbiage on the subject of eminent domain slapper

__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
bluedog

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Reply with quote  #81 
Here's what's happening.......

The wall needs to be built.......Veterans need what they've been promised........Muslims need to be sent back to their countries.......Factories, and jobs, need to return to America......Our cities need to cleaned-up and the problem of gangs needs to be addressed......Roads and bridges need maintenance.......And, common core needs to be squashed and out of our schools......Teachers need to get back control of their classrooms......

There is one, and only one, candidate that has talked about all these things......And, one other who has no hand in contributing to all this damage that has been to done to America......All the rest have seen this damage happen on their watch......On top of this, there's only one candidate who talks against big money controlling our politicians......Only one! 
keepinitreal

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Posts: 25,104
Reply with quote  #82 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedog
Here's what's happening.......

The wall needs to be built.......Veterans need what they've been promised........Muslims need to be sent back to their countries.......Factories, and jobs, need to return to America......Our cities need to cleaned-up and the problem of gangs needs to be addressed......Roads and bridges need maintenance.......And, common core needs to be squashed and out of our schools......Teachers need to get back control of their classrooms......

There is one, and only one, candidate that has talked about all these things......And, one other who has no hand in contributing to all this damage that has been to done to America......All the rest have seen this damage happen on their watch......On top of this, there's only one candidate who talks against big money controlling our politicians......Only one! 


The one you describe is Ted Cruz

__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
bluedog

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Reply with quote  #83 
And, I didn't even know it!

But, I gotta tell ya, Real, Palin doesn't agree with ya!
keepinitreal

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Posts: 25,104
Reply with quote  #84 
Palin makes a good cheerleader. She hates the establishment but joined the campaign for the 3rd establishment choice. First they hailed Jeb, he flopped, then they pooled their efforts and money for Rubio, he's sinking. Now they are doing what they can, even supporting Trump to help sink the people's candidate, Ted Cruz. Palin IS the establishment no matter her verbiage. Bluedog, I know behind the scenes you are bristling at the Palin circus. Sorry brah
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
bluedog

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Posts: 10,393
Reply with quote  #85 
I think it's hilarious.....Palin is a fake, no question about it......But, man, the free press coverage just doubled, if that's possible!
Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #86 
Whoops......


https://www.cbsnews.com/news/cliven-bundy-mistrial-declared-in-nevada-ranchers-armed-standoff-with-u-s-agents/


In the case against the Bundys, the judge hinted last week that trouble was afoot. She sent the jury home to review sealed documents following closed-door hearings over complaints about the conduct of FBI and Bureau of Land Management agents during the standoff.

Jurors got a glimpse of the claims when Ryan Bundy, who represented himself, spoke at opening statements about seeing government snipers and surveillance cameras positioned on hilltops surrounding his family home in the days before armed supporters answered his family's calls for help.

A whistleblower memo by a lead U.S. Bureau of Land Management investigator that was released last week alleges widespread bad judgment, bias and misconduct, as well as "likely policy, ethical and legal violations among senior and supervisory staff" in the days leading up to the standoff. 

The memo said agents who planned and oversaw the cattle roundup mocked and displayed clear prejudice against the Bundys, their supporters and Mormons.

The investigator, Larry Wooten, said he was removed from the investigation last February after he complained to the U.S. attorney's office in Nevada.



http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2017/12/bureau_of_land_management_supe.html



http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2017/12/blm_investigator_alleges_misco.html

BLM investigator alleges misconduct by feds in Bundy ranch standoff


__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


woody

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Reply with quote  #87 
I remember when the BLM sent military units into the area to stop locals from coming to the aid of the Bundys. It was sickening to watch military troops being used to attempt to impose an ABC agencies edict. It came to a head when citizens on horseback with American flags said no more, and advanced on the BLM hired troops. The BLM must have got a stand down order from the Obama DOJ, because the hired BLM mercenaries melted, and withdrew in the face of patriots that had had enough of government overreach, and were prepared to defend their rights as American citizens against a politicized BLM run amok and attacking ranchers.

I also distinctly remember the Leftists on this forum who were encouraging the BLM to use a heavy hand and kill anyone that dared defy the Obama administration and their all knowing intelligent authority. You see Leftist Socialist, this is what happens when you cede your God given and constitutionally guaranteed rights over to an ideology that does not have INDIVIDUAL freedom at the heart of their thought process, and party identity. We are not a mass of flesh to be manipulated, or trifled with.

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Rats flee from the sinking vessel. They traverse nimbly upon a rope, safely cleated to the dock, that is private enterprise. Socialism is dead, and tits up in the water. A bloated, death show, for rubberneckers of all classes to view.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #88 
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/01/08/576502739/judge-dismisses-federal-case-against-cliven-bundy-and-sons-bars-retrial



Judge Dismisses Federal Case Against Cliven Bundy And Sons, Bars Retrial


Updated at 2:49 p.m. ET

Less than one month after U.S. District Judge Gloria Navarro declared a mistrialin the case against Cliven Bundy, his two sons, and a self-styled militiaman, Navarro has dismissed the charges entirely. The decision Monday puts an end to the federal case against the four men for their role in the 2014 armed standoff over cattle-grazing rights in Nevada.

Navarro found that the prosecution had committed "flagrant misconduct" by withholding evidence that could have supported the defendants' case. Namely, Navarro explained that federal prosecutors had failed to disclose information from cameras recording video from the standoff and the presence of federal snipers around the Bundy Ranch.

Navarro ruled that as a result, the men, who had been slapped with felony conspiracy and firearms charges, could not receive a fair trial. She dismissed the charges "with prejudice," which specifically bars the possibility of bringing a new trial against them.

"The court finds that the universal sense of justice has been violated," Navarro said Monday, according to The Los Angeles Times.


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Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #89 
http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2018/01/cliven_bundy_standoff_case_thr.html



The judge found prosecutors engaged in a "deliberate attempt to mislead" and made several misrepresentations to both the defense and the court about evidence relating to a surveillance camera, snipers outside the Bundy ranch in early April 2014 and threat assessments made in the case.

"The court is troubled by the prosecution's failure to look beyond the FBI file," Navarro said.

She said she "seriously questions" that the FBI "inexplicably placed or perhaps hid" information on the placement a tactical operations log that referred to the presence of snipers on a "thumb drive inside a vehicle for three years." 

The judge found it especially egregious that the prosecutors chose not to share documents that the defendants specially asked for in pretrial motions, and "grossly shocking''  that the prosecutors claimed they weren't aware the material would assist the defendants in their defense.

"The government was well aware of theories of self defense, provocation and intimidation,'' Navarro said.

 The judge found the prosecutors' violations were "willful" and led to due process violations. She said they waited too long to provide FBI and other agency reports and maps on surveillance, including the location of a camera and snipers, outside the Bundy ranch; threat assessments that indicated the Bundys weren't violent; and nearly 500 pages of U.S. Bureau of Land Management internal affairs documents that included paperwork indicating that cattle grazing hadn't threatened the desert tortoise, considered an endangered species.

Late disclosures of evidence trickled out just before and during the start of the trial "by happenstance,'' defense lawyers noted. One government witness under cross-examination by Ryan Bundy acknowledged watching live-feed video images from an FBI surveillance camera and another referenced a 2012 FBI threat assessment that determined the Bundys weren't likely to be violent. In pretrial motions, Ryan Bundy requested evidence on any "mysterious devices'' outside the Bundy ranch in early April 2014, and Payne's lawyers sought all threat assessments in July 2017, but prosecutors didn't turn over the information until ordered days before or during trial.

Defense lawyers argued that the government didn't "seem to recognize'' or "professed ignorance'' on what constituted Brady material, required by the 1963 landmark U.S. Supreme Court ruling in Brady v. Maryland to be shared with the defense.

The defense lawyers urged dismissal, saying it was the only sufficient remedy for the government's callous disregard of its constitutional obligations to share any potentially favorable evidence with the defense.

Assistant federal public defender Brenda Weksler, who represents Payne, argued that prosecutors repeatedly failed to abide by deadlines for sharing discovery evidence, were dismissive of specific requests for evidence, engaged in a "pattern to ridicule and disparage the defense" requests and then made "brazen proffers" to the court that specific information didn't exist, only to find out later that they were mistaken.

"The fact that the government sought to ask a jury to convict these defendants and then ask this Court to sentence them to prison for the rest of their lives without giving the defense the information recently disclosed should more than trouble this Court,'' Weksler wrote in a recently unsealed motion to dismiss.

Prosecutors countered that any failure to provide evidence was "inadvertent'' or because they reasonably believed the law didn't require them to share the material. They sought a new trial, arguing that they "neither flagrantly violated nor recklessly disregarded" their evidence obligations, but believed the material they failed to share in a timely manner wasn't relevant for the defendants' defense.


__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #90 
Sounds like Mt. Carmel.  Bundys are American heroes and I bet dietwatereddown coke is curled up in the fetal position over the ruling.

Reno, Holder and Lynch all put their biases over the law

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