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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #61 
Reads like a Nigerian prince email
MadDogsDad

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Reply with quote  #62 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElGarfio


My Pov does not say anything like that. My pov says that not having a left fielder out there against a left handed batter is a stupid move. There is nothing you will say or anyone else can say that is going to change that. The risks far outweigh the gain. If you keep betting a horse that is 99-1 and a 99-1 shot wins the 350th time you make the bet. Guess what? You still lost money. She was lucky to beat Tulsa. She shouldn't have beat Tulsa. Stop and think about that. You have those athletes and you're down by 3 runs in the 7th inning in an elimination game to Tulsa? 


She doesn't apply the shift against left handed batters, only right handed batters.

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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #63 
Righty on righty only. Middle-in velocity and any offspeed off the table
ChinMusic

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Reply with quote  #64 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadDogsDad


She doesn't apply the shift against left handed batters, only right handed batters.


CORRECT. Apparently EG hasn't watched quite as many OU games as he said he has. Just another hater with no clue what he's talking about.
MadDogsDad

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Reply with quote  #65 
There is the other side of the equation that hasn't been discussed in the Gasso shift conversation.

What about the outs that were recorded that would have been hits if Oklahoma was in a regular defense or in the shift that leaves the outfield in place? I would think those outs may have saved a few runs.

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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #66 
Those are relatively smallish unaccounted-for areas that that defender is being folded into.

But, without some MLB-caliber graphs, hard to say
MadDogsDad

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Reply with quote  #67 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
Those are relatively smallish unaccounted-for areas that that defender is being folded into.

But, without some MLB-caliber graphs, hard to say


Isn't that the point of a shift, to take away the small unaccounted for areas by flooding an area with additional defenders?

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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #68 
The key word is ... small
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #69 
I deleted that post... wanna try figuring out the space involved
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #70 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
Those are relatively smallish unaccounted-for areas that that defender is being folded into.

But, without some MLB-caliber graphs, hard to say


You don't seem to be having a problem saying it at all.  Maybe PG has more info than you?

What did you think of the shift when it first happened in baseball?  

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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #71 
Vacating the left fielder???????

I guess I missed that one.

Only time I have ever seen two OFs in MLB is in walk-off situations where any ball hit farther than 250 ends the game and a fifth INF can help get an inning-ending DP or force at the plate
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #72 
They sports are played at VASTLY different dimensions.

PG has elite RH hitters, some of the best in the country.  Don't you think they might have tried it in practice before waking up one day and just deciding to try it in a game, much less a regional final?



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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #73 
YOU are the yahoo asking what I thought the first time it happened in baseball.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNarrator


What did you think of the shift when it first happened in baseball?  


And now you are yapping about dimensions?

NO S***, Sherlock

There are dozens of coaches in the past who have had much more dominant pitching, and from 40 feet. So they are all just not as smart as Gasso? LOL

OU's fans would be booming from the highest landfill out there if Tulsa had gotten those three outs after that shift debacle.

So disingenuous and hypocritical
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #74 
So i guess no one is allowed to disagree with you without a little salt being thrown their way?  You must be a joy to live with.

The dimensions are extremely important because fields with different dimensions will allow for different shifts.  Who knows what baseball guys would come up with if they studied softball and knew the pitchers as well as PG knows hers.  I applaud her for having the "gumption" to try something different.  It worked - we really don't know in the small sample size if statistically it was the right move, but I am guessing PG knows her pitcher and the opposing hitters a little bit better than you.  Maybe I am wrong and you are in the bully with her every day and at their scrimmages as well.

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ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #75 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChinMusic
CORRECT. Apparently EG hasn't watched quite as many OU games as he said he has. Just another hater with no clue what he's talking about.

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ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #76 
Ah more chin music blah blah blah. Get happy Chin. How many more post do I need before I become an expert like you?
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ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #77 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNarrator
So i guess no one is allowed to disagree with you without a little salt being thrown their way?  You must be a joy to live with.

The dimensions are extremely important because fields with different dimensions will allow for different shifts.  Who knows what baseball guys would come up with if they studied softball and knew the pitchers as well as PG knows hers.  I applaud her for having the "gumption" to try something different.  It worked - we really don't know in the small sample size if statistically it was the right move, but I am guessing PG knows her pitcher and the opposing hitters a little bit better than you.  Maybe I am wrong and you are in the bully with her every day and at their scrimmages as well.


Sorry Narrator, Leaving an entire outfield open is not smart. I don't care if you're practicing with her or sitting on the bench right next to her. Your last line of defense is 60 feet away. I don't understand how you or anyone else can defend that. Regardless of the dimensions of the field, Gasso is leaving a huge area wide open. She can't just move the 3rd baseman over there like a regular shift. Take the insurance the left fielder represents. You don't need to re-invent the wheel, college coaches try to be too cute. The game has been around for 200 years and Gasso isn't coming up with anything new. If you think Gasso is the next coaching genius I have some land I want you to look at for a really good deal. 

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Stanford_Softball

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Reply with quote  #78 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElGarfio
Why would Eriksen pull Jessica Moore in the 7th? Here's the situation: Bottom of the 7th Team USA leading 3-1. Barnhill pitching. An error and a walk induces a pitching change by Eriksen. In comes Jessica Moore who gets a fly ball and a ground out. Eriksen decides that he needs to pull Moore and bring in Carda? The first batter walks to load the bases and then a walk off grand slam. I don't understand the move in the rubber game of the series against the top ranked team in the world. What's the thought process?


What it sounds like to me is the same thing that happened when I was watching the WBSC XII World Cup in Surrey. What happened is Traina was pitching and a certain batter came up, They Pulled Traina and they put in Carda. After that batter they pulled Carda and they put in Gourley. So it sounds like a failed attempt at the same thing they did in Surrey. As for the coaching I have no opinion

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Stanford_Softball

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Reply with quote  #79 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElGarfio
These college coaches are trying to reinvent the wheel. I realize we are all armchair QB's but this is pretty basic stuff.  The worst coaching moves I've ever seen are made by college softball coaches. They get away with them more times than they should.Most of these "Big Time" Teams like Oklahoma get a recruit like Keilani Ricketts and Oregon, Jessica Moore, James Madison Megan Good. They are suddenly catapulted to championship status. They win in spite of their coaching shortfalls. I set my DVR and recorded all of the Softball Championship this year. The coaching mistakes and dumb moves are mind boggling. The Oklahoma shift? Comon Man! Yet she has back to back WCWS victories. Some of the best coaches I've seen are at mid majors and community colleges. If you want to see someone coach go watch a top tier community college coach. They can't afford to make mistakes if they do their athletes can't make up for it.


The Oklahoma Shift makes complete sense. If you hear the announcers explain it I think it's a great idea. Because Lowary throws so hard and she jams hitters, Not to mention she is a dropball pitcher that gets a lot of groundball outs. Because she throws so hard it is very unlikely that someone can pull the ball because most hitters have trouble getting bat on ball at that speed, She is throwing them inside which means it is going to the left side and she is throwing a dropball which is hard to get more than a groundball off of. With all of those combined it makes sense that you bring in another fielder so that you are able to get more coverage. I don't fully understand why they switch outfield positions but the extra infielder thing makes sense to me.

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MadDogsDad

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Reply with quote  #80 
Mendez has more speed than Pendley is the reason for the outfielder switch.
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outofzone

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Reply with quote  #81 
This gimmic will never win a single game for OK but, it most certainly can lose games. And when that happens it will be interesting to hear the excuses. 

And how soon before the first Travel Coach jumps on this bandwagon.
ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #82 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone
This gimmic will never win a single game for OK but, it most certainly can lose games. And when that happens it will be interesting to hear the excuses. 

And how soon before the first Travel Coach jumps on this bandwagon.

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ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #83 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone
This gimmic will never win a single game for OK but, it most certainly can lose games. And when that happens it will be interesting to hear the excuses. 

And how soon before the first Travel Coach jumps on this bandwagon.


Another voice of reason. Thank you! People defending vacating left field is baffling!

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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #84 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ElGarfio


Sorry Narrator, Leaving an entire outfield open is not smart. I don't care if you're practicing with her or sitting on the bench right next to her. Your last line of defense is 60 feet away. I don't understand how you or anyone else can defend that. Regardless of the dimensions of the field, Gasso is leaving a huge area wide open. She can't just move the 3rd baseman over there like a regular shift. Take the insurance the left fielder represents. You don't need to re-invent the wheel, college coaches try to be too cute. The game has been around for 200 years and Gasso isn't coming up with anything new. If you think Gasso is the next coaching genius I have some land I want you to look at for a really good deal. 


Uh - ok. You didn't even know when she put the shift on. They were playing softball in 1817? That's a new one.

National championships:
Patty - 4
Idiot on message board - 0

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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #85 
The Williams shift:

https://i.genius.com/f6b3d45cbff3b706ca508b1817187081fd8fd06e?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vintagecardprices.com%2Fpics%2F402%2F28%2F65420.jpg

On my cell so I can't post the pic - hopefully someone else can

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ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #86 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNarrator
Uh - ok. You didn't even know when she put the shift on. They were playing softball in 1817? That's a new one. National championships: Patty - 4 Idiot on message board - 0


Sorry it hasn't quite been 200 years, baseball was invented in 1839. In 22 years it will have been 200 years. 22 more years which is probably your age. Another 22 years from now maybe you will be wiser and understand the nuances of baseball and softball. At this point your Softball IQ is that of an 8 year old.

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ElGarfio

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Reply with quote  #87 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNarrator
The Williams shift: https://i.genius.com/f6b3d45cbff3b706ca508b1817187081fd8fd06e?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.vintagecardprices.com%2Fpics%2F402%2F28%2F65420.jpg On my cell so I can't post the pic - hopefully someone else can


I don't see anywhere in here where they vacated an outfielder

Infield shift

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
 

The infield shift is a generic term used in baseball to describe an extreme defensive realignment from the standard positions to blanket one side of the field or another. Used almost exclusively against left-handed batters, it is designed to protect against extra base hits pulled hard into the gaps between the fielders on the right side.

Originally called the "Boudreau" or "Williams" shift, the strategy is often associated with Ted Williams, but it was actually first employed against Cy Williams during the 1920s.[1][2] It was later used against Ted Williams during the 1946 World Series between the Red Sox and the Cardinals as a defensive gimmick by St. Louis manager Eddie Dyer to psych out and hopefully contain Boston slugger Williams. It was devised by Cleveland Indians manager Lou Boudreau on a blackboard between games of a doubleheader in July 1946 to halt Williams' hot hitting. "I always considered The Boudreau Shift a psychological, rather than a tactical victory," wrote Lou Boudreau in his book, Player-Manager. The shift has been employed since then to thwart extreme pull hitters (mostly lefties), such as Barry BondsRyan HowardJason GiambiDavid Ortiz, and Mark Teixeira.

Typically the third baseman moves to the left where the shortstop plays; the shortstop plays to the right of second; the second baseman plays between first and second and usually on the right field grass; the center fielder plays right-center; and the first baseman and right fielder hug the foul line. Sometimes, the third baseman will move to where the shortstop moves, since the fielder on the left side plays shortstop, it makes sense to have the actual shortstop there. While this is the most common type of defensive shift seen in baseball, there are numerous variations that can be implemented according to the hitting ability of the batter. For example, an effective defensive shift against Joe Mauer would have the infield shifted for a pull-happy left hander, and the outfield shifted for a pull-happy right-hander, due to Mauer's uncommon tendency to pull nearly all of his groundballs, and hit nearly all of his flyballs to the opposite field.[3]

Infield shifts have become more common in recent years, and the tactic's drawbacks have become more apparent. For example, in the 2009 World SeriesJohnny Damon of the New York Yankees stole two bases on one pitch against the Philadelphia Phillies due to an infield shift: Damon stole second, and, after the third baseman covered second and was pulled away from the base, immediately headed for the uncovered third base.

In the 1970s, Willie McCovey of the San Francisco Giants bunted hard down the third base line when the shift was on. Willie Mays, on first at the time, came all the way around to score, while McCovey reached second for a double.[4]


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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #88 
In the Williams shift there appears to be about 190 feet from the leftfielder to the fence. Pretty apparent they pulled the leftfielder in to be a deep shortstop.

Sorry if you are unable to understand that. Pretty apparent from your short time here that you're probably not able to

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Drop_Curve

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Reply with quote  #89 
I can't believe people are debating this when OU won a national championship. Yeah it didn't work against Tulsa but it worked plenty of other times and now the season is over. Why are people so up in arms about this? sheesh they probably won't do it next year as it was mostly a way to get Lowary to focus.
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Scupino

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Reply with quote  #90 
Williams' Shift
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