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sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #31 
You are being nice Fib.
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Susan
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #32 
people wake up to the fact that people running our country have no clue on how to react to politics in the Middle East. They should hire me for advise.
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #33 
Especially, after Obama and Hillary have screwed up for over four years backing the MB!
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Susan
JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #34 
Susan - You just couldn't help yourself when an opportunity for a cheap shot arose, could you?     Frank
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"Freethinkers are those who are willing to use their minds without prejudice and without fearing to understand things that clash with their own customs, privileges, or beliefs. This state of mind is not common, but it is essential for right thinking. Where it is absent discussion is apt to become worse than useless." Leo Tolstoy

"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #35 
When the truth fits you need to own it.  Some of the people on this board JG like to hold govt and politicians accountable for their actions no matter what side of the aisle. Its a shame everybody wonr since its our money they are screwing us with.
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Susan
ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #36 
Saw this letter from Assad to Obama:

Well, here we are. It’s been two years of fighting, over 100,000 people are dead, there are no signs of this war ending, and a week ago I used chemical weapons on my own people. If you don’t do anything about it, thousands of Syrians are going to die. If you do something about it, thousands of Syrians are going to die. Morally speaking, you’re on the hook for those deaths no matter how you look at it.

So, it’s your move, America. What’s it going to be?

I’ve looked at your options, and I’m going to be honest here, I feel for you. Not exactly an embarrassment of riches you’ve got to choose from, strategy-wise. I mean, my God, there are just so many variables to consider, so many possible paths to choose, each fraught with incredible peril, and each leading back to the very real, very likely possibility that no matter what you do it’s going to backfire in a big, big way. It’s a good old-fashioned mess, is what this is! And now, you have to make some sort of decision that you can live with.

So, where do I begin? Well, this is just the tip of the iceberg, but let’s start with the fact that my alliance with Russia and China means that nothing you decide to do will have the official support of the UN Security Council. So, right off the bat, I’ve already eliminated the possibility of a legally sound united coalition like in Libya or the First Gulf War. Boom. Gone. Off the table.

Now, let’s say you’re okay with that, and you decide to go ahead with, oh, I don’t know, a bombing campaign. Now, personally, I can see how that might seem like an attractive option for you. No boots on the ground, it sends a clear message, you could cripple some of my government’s infrastructure, and it’s a quick, clean, easy way to punish me and make you look strong in the face of my unimaginable tyranny. But let’s get real here. Any bombing campaign capable of being truly devastating to my regime would also end up killing a ton of innocent civilians, as such things always do, which I imagine is the kind of outcome you people would feel very guilty about. You know, seeing as you are so up in arms to begin with about innocent Syrians dying. Plus, you’d stoke a lot of anti-American hatred and quite possibly create a whole new generation of Syrian-born jihadists ready to punish the United States for its reckless warmongering and yadda yadda yadda.

Okay, what else? Well, you could play small-ball and hope that limited airstrikes to a few of my key military installations will send me the message to refrain from using chemical weapons again, but, c’mon, check me out: I’m ruthless, I’m desperate, and I’m going to do everything I can to stay in power. I’d use chemical weapons again in a heartbeat. You know that. And I know you know that. Hell, I want to help you guys out here, but you gotta be realistic. Trust me, I am incapable of being taught a lesson at this point. Got it? I am too far gone. Way too far gone.

Oh, and I know some of you think a no-fly zone will do the trick, but we both know you can’t stomach the estimated $1 billion a month that would cost, so wave bye-bye to that one, too.

Moving on.

I suppose you could always, you know, not respond with military force at all. But how can you do that? I pumped sarin gas into the lungs of my own people, for God’s sake! You can’t just let me get away with that, can you? I mean, I guess you easily could, and spare yourself all of this headache, but then you would probably lose any of your remaining moral high ground on the world stage and make everything from the Geneva Conventions to America’s reputation as a beacon for freedom and democracy around the world look like a complete sham.

And, hey, as long as we’re just throwing stuff out there, let’s consider a ground invasion for a moment. Now, even if you could reasonably fund a ground invasion, which I’m pretty sure you can’t, what exactly would such an invasion accomplish in the long term? I suppose it’s possible that you could come in and sweep me out the door and that would be the end of it. It’s possible. You know, like, in the sense that seeing a majestic white Bengal tiger in the wild is possible. Or, more likely, you could find yourself entrenched in a full-blown civil war that drags on for 15 years and sets off further turmoil in the rest of the region, leading to even more dead bodies for your country and mine, and even more virulent hatred of America. In fact, boy, maybe this is the one option that should be totally off the table.

Oh, and speaking of me being toppled from power, let’s say, just for fun, that tomorrow I were to somehow be dethroned. Who’s in charge? Half of these rebel groups refuse to work with one another and it’s getting harder to tell which ones are actually just Islamic extremists looking to fill a potential power vacuum. We’ve got Christians, Sunnis, and Shias all poised to fight one another for control should I fall. You want to be the ones sorting through that mess when you’re trying to build a new government? I didn’t think so.

So, all in all, quite the pickle you’re in, isn’t it? I have to say, I do not envy you here. Really curious to see where you go with this one.

I’ll leave you with this: I am insane. Not insane enough to generate worldwide unanimity that I cannot remain in charge of my own country. That would make this a lot easier. No, unfortunately, I’m just sane and stable enough to remain in power and devise cunning military and political strategies while at the same time adhering to a standard of morality that only the most perverse and sociopathic among us would be capable of adopting. But nevertheless, I am insane, so do with that information what you will.

Long story short, I’m going to keep doing my best to hold on to my country no matter what the cost. If that means bombing entire towns, murdering small children, or shooting at UN weapons inspectors, so be it. I’m in this for the long haul. And you will do...whatever it is you’re going to do, which is totally up to you. Your call.

Anyway, let me know what you decide. I'll be waiting.

Reprinted without permission from the onion.
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #37 
If only Obama hadn't said that the use of chemical weapons would mean "enormous consequences".  There is no use in warning or threatening these people - they don't care and it just puts you in a box.
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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
woody

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Reply with quote  #38 
I just want to know the origins of the nerve gas. Did Syria manufacture it, or did it originate from another country? Why were Russian special forces entering the country en mass at the start of the conflict? Were they securing WMD's? The Russians don't want Hezbollah, or other outside factions having these weapons. It would destabilize the region. They want the status quo, and we should oblige. If we need to make a statement, consult with the Russians via back channels, and bomb an aspirin factory, and proclaim victory, and walk away. If this is all it takes for the President to save face, then lob a single cruise missile into Syria, and walk away quickly.
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Ignorance is forgivable, and correctable with proper study. Stupidity is a way of life.


ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #39 
Here is a brief history of what has happened after "limited" US strikes.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/parallels/2013/08/27/216194529/limited-u-s-strikes-followed-by-major-attacks-on-u-s?sc=tw&cc=share
JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #40 
Rumsfeld says that Obama has not proven the need for intervention in Syria.  Why does this make me laugh out loud?     Frank    
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"Freethinkers are those who are willing to use their minds without prejudice and without fearing to understand things that clash with their own customs, privileges, or beliefs. This state of mind is not common, but it is essential for right thinking. Where it is absent discussion is apt to become worse than useless." Leo Tolstoy

"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #41 
the question that i would like to be answered is : Do we know who we will be aiding by bombing Syria,and getting rid of Assad. we made the same mistake in Iraq, lybia and Egypt. those taking over from Assad will most likely be more anti Israel.
ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #42 
Obama's sudden desire to attack Assad is even more interesting in light of the fact that he refused to send gas mask and other CW protections to Syria, and they have been pleading for it for over a year!

Wtf is wrong with our President?

From The Daily Beast:

Exclusive: Obama Refused to Send Gas Masks to Syrian Opposition for Over a Year
by Josh Rogin Aug 29, 2013 4:45 AM EDT
Syrian opposition groups have been asking for gas masks and chemical-weapons protection gear for more than a year—and the Obama administration decided not to supply them, Josh Rogin reports exclusively.


http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/08/29/obama-refused-to-send-gas-masks-to-syria-opposition-for-over-a-year.html
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #43 
He's a politician who knows nothing about foreign policyand being a leader.  Dontshow favorites.  Plus I think he has real difficulties cause he has gotten into bed with the MB. It really is not surprising.  Unfortunately.  #failed leader.
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Susan
mikec

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Reply with quote  #44 
Left/right politics aside, I am having a hard time understanding what's in this for us.  All of our allies have bailed - what do we have to gain by doing anything here?

I just don't see it.
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #45 
As i have said often : ask the armament industry
bhblue

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Reply with quote  #46 
If you go to military.com and check out the videos, you'll see who the Syrian rebels are. You'll notice every time they do anything, they shout "Allahu akbar". Islamists? You'll also notice their utter ineptitude. The fact that the government of Syria hasn't crushed these morons says alot about their capabilities. Whoever wins this can't be much of a credible threat. Stay out Obama. Your face is not worth saving.
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #47 
Again - the problem is that a year ago, Obama built a box and now finds himself in it.  If he hadn't run his mouth about a red line, he wouldn't be in a pickle.  It shows that he has no doctrine when it comes to foreign policy - he just says what sounds politically expedient at the time.

We should not do anything with Syria as horrible as their suffering has been because it does nothing for our national security interests.

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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #48 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
Left/right politics aside, I am having a hard time understanding what's in this for us.  All of our allies have bailed - what do we have to gain by doing anything here?

I just don't see it.


Maybe he can go on Jay Leno and talk to the American people about the pros and cons.  That's his safest avenue and he feels comfortable on that couch.  There are no positives for us in Syria, his window of opportunity closed while he was on the campaign trail.

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"Getting your motor revved about taking our guns is going to be what undoes your efforts."

"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #49 
Does anyone remember all the criticism Bush received prior to Iraq/Afghanistan about not having a coalition of allies in place, even though he did have some allies in place?
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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #50 
Kerry just gone on TV building obomber's case for going into Syrian airspace and bombing them
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"Getting your motor revved about taking our guns is going to be what undoes your efforts."

"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #51 
Does this constitute an act of war and, if so, wouldn't we need Congressional authorization?
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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #52 
This exchange between the buffoon Biden and the slobbering Chris Matthews back in 2007 would be hilarious if it weren't so sad.  Substitute Obama for Bush and Syria for Iran and you have the boob Biden saying the same thing about his own boss.  The thing about Biden is that he is 100% political, 0% intelligent and 100% cheap when it comes to charitable giving.  What a nincompoop.  And, by the way, Iran is 1,000 times more dangerous to our interests than is Syria.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/08/30/flashback_biden_threatens_bush_with_impeachment_for_military_strike_without_congressional_authorization.html

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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #53 
pabar61, you should know that we will never attack Iran, as it the the country that provides most of our oil. Also be aware that the brotish are the supporter of the mullahs in Iran, as it was them that forced the shah out and the mullahs in.
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #54 
If I was president and I thought Iran was within 6 months of having a nuclear bomb, I would bomb them.
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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #55 
pabar61 you sure make Obama look good.
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #56 
Not only can Obama not garner any support from our allies around the world he is being called out by the 11 yr old son of Assad.
http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/08/29/facebook-post-said-to-be-by-assads-son-dares-americans-to-attack/?_r=0
#failedleader.

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#SCOTUS x two


pabar61

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Reply with quote  #57 
Hammer - is that your contribution? That's it? Seriously? Lame.
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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #58 
from my experience i have found out that summarizing is safer than generalizing.
the less you say, the safer you are. it is btter to be lame than dead.
woody

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Reply with quote  #59 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHammer
pabar61, you should know that we will never attack Iran, as it the the country that provides most of our oil. Also be aware that the brotish are the supporter of the mullahs in Iran, as it was them that forced the shah out and the mullahs in.


Hammer, what are you talking about? We get our oil imports from Canada, Mexico, Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, and a few others. We don't import oil from Iran.

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Ignorance is forgivable, and correctable with proper study. Stupidity is a way of life.


pabar61

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Reply with quote  #60 
We get most of our oil here at home.
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Will I Wynn is a poster who used to go by the name of Dewey.  He used to criticize people who did that.

"Once you open your eyes, it's impossible to be a Democrat." - CJ Pearson
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