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CousinMaynard

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Reply with quote  #1 
And neither can "Obscene", which is what the selection process has become. Just like every other thing you mother bleepers touch.

#SorryExcuseforaCollege
Grindz

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Reply with quote  #2 
K
sMurph

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Reply with quote  #3 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CousinMaynard
And neither can "Obscene", which is what the selection process has become. Just like every other thing you mother bleepers touch.

#SorryExcuseforaCollege





Awww, bless your heart.
Wilmer1

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Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CousinMaynard
And neither can "Obscene", which is what the selection process has become. Just like every other thing you mother bleepers touch.

#SorryExcuseforaCollege

Sorry your team didn't get in.  Should have taken care of business and won their tournament.
nstinson

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Reply with quote  #5 
They are biased, no doubt. There's not a lot better method, though.
LSUsoftballfan

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Reply with quote  #6 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CousinMaynard
And neither can "Obscene", which is what the selection process has become. Just like every other thing you mother bleepers touch.

#SorryExcuseforaCollege


That's a really cool story, bro.  Will read again and again to be sure I can totally capture the essence of all the nuances of the story.


Now would you like to add some details to your post so that we might discuss your outrage???
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #7 
I will say that what happened to Washington two years ago and then what happened with Georgia on Sunday feeds this monster yet again
LSUsoftballfan

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Reply with quote  #8 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
I will say that what happened to Washington two years ago and then what happened with Georgia on Sunday feeds this monster yet again


What happened to Washington 2 years ago?

I think what happened to Georgia on Sunday is a "Georgia" thing and not an SEC thing.  As has been noted a few times on this board, Georgia has been up-seeded several times in the past for untold reasons. I think it has also been pointed out that LSU has been down-seeded out of a top 8 seed a few times. Lu has those nudes of committee members and she did not share them with Girouard.

Beyond that, what is the outrage this year?  I think Kentucky hosting is a farce, but if they don't host, Auburn is the likely replacement. Missouri catches a lot of flack for being in the tournament as a barely-over-.500 team, but the Pac-12 has one of those in Oregon State. 

Outside of the inexplicable seeding of Georgia, I honestly don't see where the SEC outrage comes from.





3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSUsoftballfan



Outside of the inexplicable seeding of Georgia, I honestly don't see where the SEC outrage comes from.





Well, that was the only thing that jumped out to me this year

In 2016, Washington with an injured (but not injured-for-the-year) Alvelo was dropped from 8 to 11
Montana_Wa

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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSUsoftballfan


Beyond that, what is the outrage this year?  I think Kentucky hosting is a farce, but if they don't host, Auburn is the likely replacement. Missouri catches a lot of flack for being in the tournament as a barely-over-.500 team, but the Pac-12 has one of those in Oregon State. 



You do realize that it's not JUST Missouri's record. It's the fact they cancelled games at Wichita State. And added games with a team they could beat.

The two are NOT equal.
CrowHop

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Reply with quote  #11 
Serious question:   Could Wichita State have refused the $5000 (Paltry sum to cancel a game, IMO, ...Wichita State is one cheap date....but that's another story)?    If so, what would have happened then?  Mizzou shows up to play or forfeits?


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Devin22

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Reply with quote  #12 
I am sure the contract probably stated that at their(Mizzo) option, they could pay the $5,000 and not play...End of story... So, it wouldn't matter what Wichita State wanted.....
LSUsoftballfan

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana_Wa
You do realize that it's not JUST Missouri's record. It's the fact they cancelled games at Wichita State. And added games with a team they could beat. The two are NOT equal.


I do realize this...in fact if you see my post history, I thought Missouri should have been excluded because of this (and I was in the minority among posters here).

The committee lady was asked specifically about this and she actually gave a good answer.  She said that all the committee could do was analyze the results of games played on the field and not take into consideration the moral issue of how Missouri got those wins...and I actually believe her. It was not the committee's job to pass judgment on what Missouri did.

So I don't think "SEC bias" led to Missouri getting in.  I think if a team in another conference had pulled the same stunt, they would have gotten in, also.  In fact, didn't Oregon State attempt to do this by scheduling Seattle and have it backfire in their face when Seattle beat them?
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSUsoftballfan


I do realize this...in fact if you see my post history, I thought Missouri should have been excluded because of this (and I was in the minority among posters here).

The committee lady was asked specifically about this and she actually gave a good answer.  She said that all the committee could do was analyze the results of games played on the field and not take into consideration the moral issue of how Missouri got those wins...and I actually believe her. It was not the committee's job to pass judgment on what Missouri did.

So I don't think "SEC bias" led to Missouri getting in.  I think if a team in another conference had pulled the same stunt, they would have gotten in, also.  In fact, didn't Oregon State attempt to do this by scheduling Seattle and have it backfire in their face when Seattle beat them?

I still think what Wichita State did against Oklahoma was worse
jayrot

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Reply with quote  #15 
The butthurt is strong in this one!

But seriously, play the game or step to the side. It isnt the SECs fault that all the other conferences are under crappy management.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #16 
And, the SEC's OOC record, for every team, I'm sure is as exceptional as it was last year
speedyduck

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Reply with quote  #17 
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSUsoftballfan


I do realize this...in fact if you see my post history, I thought Missouri should have been excluded because of this (and I was in the minority among posters here).

The committee lady was asked specifically about this and she actually gave a good answer.  She said that all the committee could do was analyze the results of games played on the field and not take into consideration the moral issue of how Missouri got those wins...and I actually believe her. It was not the committee's job to pass judgment on what Missouri did.

So I don't think "SEC bias" led to Missouri getting in.  I think if a team in another conference had pulled the same stunt, they would have gotten in, also.  In fact, didn't Oregon State attempt to do this by scheduling Seattle and have it backfire in their face when Seattle beat them?


they sure did, but they still made the regionals
LSUsoftballfan

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Reply with quote  #18 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrowHop
Serious question:   Could Wichita State have refused the $5000 (Paltry sum to cancel a game, IMO, ...Wichita State is one cheap date....but that's another story)?    If so, what would have happened then?  Mizzou shows up to play or forfeits?



I think the road team has the right to exercise the option if they choose....but that is just a guess.

The other part here is that by not playing and paying $5000, Missouri probably broke even or maybe even saved a few pennies.  By the time they charter a bus (probably $3000ish), spend the night in a Wichita hotel($1500ish depending on the accommodations) and feed the team, they have spend about $5000.
HenryLouisAaron

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Reply with quote  #19 
<< I still think what Wichita State did against Oklahoma was worse >> (3LT)


I've seen you put down the Wichita State coach on numerous occasions - over that loss to Oklahoma...
Here is a rundown of what happened in the Oklahoma vs. Wichita State game.

Three pitchers threw almost all of Wichita State's innings: 
1. Bailey Lange  188.2 IP, 2.82 ERA,  3.01 FB/7,  18-12 W-L record with 6 saves. She was their clear top pitcher.
2. Caitlyn Bingham  62.1,  5.84 ERA,  5.95 FB/7,  2-5 W-L record. 
3. Bailey Klitzke  49.1,  2.98 ERA,  5.53 FB/7,  7-2 W-L record. 

These are their season stats. I'd venture a guess that Bingham's stats were better at the time of the Oklahoma game.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Wichita State started their ace, Bailey Lange.

1st:  Romero led off with a single.  Alo lined into a DP to 2B.  Knighten singled.  Pendley singled.  Clifton was called out looking.
Summary: The first 4 batters all hit Lange... but she was very fortunate that Alo's line shot went at the second baseman for a LO-DP.
And she got a third strike call against Clifton with runners on 1st & 2nd... to end the inning.

2nd:  Mendes Ks.  Wodach BB.  Arnold BB.  Aviu hits into an inning ending double play with a gb to 2B.
Summary: Two walks and a sharply hit gb that just happened to go to the second baseman.  Two innings... and 2 DPs. Lucky stuff for Lange.

3rd:  Romero leads off the inning with her second single of the game.  Alo Ks.  Knighten fly out to RF.  Pendley pops up to SS.
Summary: Besides Romero's single... a solid inning from Lange.

4th:  Clifton gb to SS.  Mendes Ks.  Wodach fly out RF.
Summary: Excellent inning by Lange.

5th:  Arnold HBP on first pitch of the inning.  Aviu fly out to CF on a well hit ball (on a 3-2 count) after a 7 pitch at bat.

This is the point where the Wichita coach decided to take out Lange.  The primary reason for this decision, in my view, is that Romero was coming up to bat...
Syd had hit the ball sharply off of Lange in both of her first two at bats - with two singles to show for her efforts.
The thinking was let's see if someone else can get her out.

So... with a runner on first and one out - a pitching change was made. They bring in Bingham to pitch and Lange goes to RF.

The game resumes... and with a 0-1 count, Romero hits a liner to the first baseman - who steps on first for a LO-DP.
Summary: Genius coaching move. They take out the starting pitcher who had been unable to get Romero out... 
and the replacement gets a DP and the inning is over.  
So far, in 5 innings... Wichita State has escaped with the great fortune to have THREE double plays. Can their luck last..???

6th:  After 6 pitches, Bingham walks Alo on a full count.  After 7 pitches, Bingham walks Knighten on a full count. 
Facing Oklahoma's #2 and #3 batters, Bingham made some good pitches... but just couldn't quite get the job done against either batter.
Being ahead 6-0, it was her job to NOT walk those hitters... and she failed. But she did make a decent effort at trying to retire two of Oklahoma's best hitters.

The Wichita State coach decides those two walks are enough... and it's time to bring his ace back in to pitch (with runners on 1st & 2nd with no outs - and still leading 6-0).
Lange has been used as a relief pitcher before. This is NOT anything new for her.
She walks Pendley on a 3-1 count.  Bases loaded.
She walks Clifton on a 3-1 count.  Oklahoma scores its first run (1-6).
Mendes hits a gb to 2B that goes for a 4-6 FC.  Oklahoma scores its second run (2-6).  1 out, runners on the corners.
Wichita State still has a 4 run lead... and they could get out of this without too much damage - as Oklahoma has their weakest batters coming up.
On a 1-1 count, Lea Wodach hits the ball over the right field wall for a 3 run HR.
The score is now 5-6... but the bases are empty and the #8 & #9 batters are due up. 
Lange walks Arnold on a 3-1 count. 

That's it. The Wichita State coach has seen enough. He's got to take out his ace - and bring in someone else.
Bailey Klitske comes in. While she pitched only about a quarter as many innings as Lange... her ERA and opBA about the same as Lange's. 

Klitzke walks Aviu on a 3-1 count. Now there are runners on 1st & 2nd  with 1 out.
And who's coming up to bat..?  Sydney Romero.  Klitzke gets ahead of Romero 0-2... 
but the Syd singles into LF.  The runner is stopped at third... leaving the bases loaded.
And now it is Jocelyn Alo coming up to bat.  Alo singles into right center, scoring two runs... and Oklahoma leads 7-6.

There is still just one out - with runners on the corners... and Shay Knighten batting.
Alo steals second base. and now it's runners on 2nd & 3rd with Knighten at the plate.
The Sooners are looking very good to add some insurance runs... 
But... Klitzke gets Shay on a pop up to second base. 
And then Pendley on a fly out to LF in foul territory.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Wichita State still has the 7th inning... but Lowary comes in and gets 3 gb outs - and the game is over.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Final summary:  It's not like Lange pitched that great in the first 4.1 innings of that game.  She gave up 4 hits, 2 walks and a HBP. She was fortunate to get two DPs. When their coach saw Romero coming up to bat - after going 2 for 2 vs. Lange - a decision was made to try someone else...  and it worked.

They could have put Lange back in to start the 6th, and in retrospect I'm sure they would.  But Bingham had gotten the job done to end the 5th... so they let her stay in to start the 6th. That's not hard to understand. It was a reasonable choice. AND... when Bingham couldn't quite get the job done on those first two batters of the 6th inning... the Wichita coach went back to his ace pitcher.  They still had a 6-0 lead... and they still had there best pitcher ready to come back in - and shut the door.

Their luck just didn't hold up over six innings... the way it had in the first five.
CrowHop

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Reply with quote  #20 
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedyduck


they sure did, but they still made the regionals


Yes, but their "reward" was going to Norman. [crazy]

They won't be there long.

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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #21 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HenryLouisAaron

These are their season stats. I'd venture a guess that Bingham's stats were better at the time of the Oklahoma game.

They were absolutely not.

5.75 ERA

WARNING: Now, here comes Hank, spewing about how a 5.75 ERA then IS INDEED better than the current 5.84
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #22 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HenryLouisAaron
While she pitched only about a quarter as many innings as Lange... her ERA and opBA about the same as Lange's. 

Holy crap.... Do you ever ponder adding the remotest of context to this verbal diarrhea????

Parker Conrad has a BETTER ERA than Parker AND Lowary!!!

Nice to know that you are espousing Conrad starting the super regional opener because she is obviously an equal pitcher if not better

For gosh sake.

Hard to find a legitimate circumstance where you have ONE pitcher on staff who can pitch, she is throwing a shutout and has a six-run lead, has an out in the fifth and she is taken out...

I don't want to hear jack squat about how Mizzou soiled this softball season.

I would like for that WSU coach to explain herself wayyyyyy before I hear anything from Gina Fogue.
Wichita_Mustangs

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Reply with quote  #23 
I can vouch for the WSU coach. She is a class act....and trust me...wanted to win the OU game more than anything else.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #24 
I would still like to hear a media member grow a spine and ask her what the hell she was thinking.

She brought the kid back into the game after all the horses had left the barn, so it wasn't an injury
oufanforever

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Reply with quote  #25 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
I would still like to hear a media member grow a spine and ask her what the hell she was thinking.

She brought the kid back into the game after all the horses had left the barn, so it wasn't an injury

I don't think you can question the motivations of the coach simply because you don't agree with the decision and have the benefit of hindsight. If OU lost the 17 inning game last year, would you question coach Gasso was intentionally throwing the game due to her coaching decisions?

I found Henry's explanation above to be reasonable and more likely than a coach throwing a game.

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HenryLouisAaron

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Reply with quote  #26 
<< I'd venture a guess that Bingham's stats were better at the time of the Oklahoma game. >> (me)

<< They were absolutely not.   
5.75 ERA  >> (3LT)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I said it was merely a guess.

That doesn't change anything else that was written. Why did you focus just on that tiny tidbit..?


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


<< While she (Klitzke) pitched only about a quarter as many innings as Lange... her ERA and opBA about the same as Lange's. >> (me)

<< Holy crap.... Do you ever ponder adding the remotest of context to this verbal diarrhea???? >> (3LT)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Again... with you focusing in on something of very little significance. 
The point of that sentence was that Klitzke had pitched reasonably well (about as well as Lange).
That is absolutely true.

So why do you focus your response - on that..???

Both of your response posts miss the mark completely. 
You basically chose to make NO reasonable or worthwhile response to my post.
Instead, you made two remarks on points that are of very nearly zero significance.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Focus in on something of some substance...
The coach took the starter out because she had been hit pretty well by Oklahoma (and been lucky to have not given up runs)... 
and she had been hit particularly well by Romero... who was now coming up for the third time.

And... the coach also knew that the starter could be put right back in - after Romero had batted.

THAT is a reasonable thought process. 

If you want to debate the decision to not bring back Lange to begin the 6th... go ahead.
At least that would be a response worth discussing.

If you want to write some sort of meaningful, worthwhile response - focus on the real points.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #27 
Quote:
Originally Posted by oufanforever

I don't think you can question the motivations of the coach simply because you don't agree with the decision and have the benefit of hindsight.


Say what you want, but this is not hindsight

http://robocoach.websitetoolbox.com/post/show_single_post?pid=1303858654&postcount=749&forum=10114

Is it possible it was simply an idiotic decision, to bring in a kid with a previous 11.40 ERA and 2.399 WHIP against teams that, like Oklahoma, would end up in the tournament field (Washington, Michigan, Texas, Ohio StateX2), over a kid who -- for whatever reason -- had bageled the Sooners through 4 1/3 and had retired six of the past seven Oklahoma batters -- and had a 6-0 lead?

Is it possible a few years ago that Charleston Southern's Jennifer Giles was throwing a 3-0 shutout through five innings in Gainesville, and then miraculously was illegal three times in the sixth?

Sure.

Got me there.
RahOKU

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Reply with quote  #28 
I thought it was a great case of over-managing, which just about every coach or baseball manager is guilty of from time to time. Brain cramp? Whatever, the WSU team's confidence escaped like air from a balloon. It was palpable, and as often is the case, once you lose your mojo to a better team it's really hard to get it back, and the Shockers didn't.

I remember the game as the advent of The Wodach -- Lea's rediscovering the confidence to be a credible threat at the plate.

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3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #29 
The Wodach WAS unleashed!

Very true
scrybe

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Reply with quote  #30 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
They were absolutely not.

5.75 ERA

WARNING: Now, here comes Hank, spewing about how a 5.75 ERA then IS INDEED better than the current 5.84


....said the King of the Obscure Stat.
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