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3leftturns

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https://softball-nation.com/2018/09/12/former-ull-players-hire-attorney-to-push-title-ix-complaints/
1janiedough

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So Craighton, Denham and Lotief are part of the suit, but I have never heard of any of the other players.
Wilmer1

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1janiedough


So Craighton, Denham and Lotief are part of the suit, but I have never heard of any of the other players.

They filed a complaint, not a lawsuit.  This is the first step to filing a potential lawsuit.  I am trying to figure out the end game here with the complaint.  The school will most certainly defend itself against the complaint and any potential suit.  I wonder if these young ladies are hoping for some type of settlement to just go away.
EarlyGrayce

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Wilmer right out of the gate with the denigrating "they are doing it for the money" muse? Alrighty then.
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"What questions are not getting answered.  The only ones I see being avoided is "Why you switch from Dewey to Will I Wynn?"  and  "Why you switch from Bama_CF to Fresh?" and of course the best one that will never get answered, never in a million years... "When you bringing back KPI?"

3leftturns

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1janiedough


So Craighton, Denham and Lotief are part of the suit, but I have never heard of any of the other players.
Doni Sanders?
TerpAlum

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Lotief being part of it damages the credibility.

However, Title IX complaints about sport opportunities and conditions are not personal lawsuits with pay-offs to individuals to go away. Anyone who saw the alleged issues can file a complaint (ie, any taxpayer), so think about that when you are thinking about motivation. Students are not employees and would not get paid anything.

The results often are that the program makes changes or has to receive oversight from the Feds, usually in a settlement. Largely, the only way a litigant can get anything is if they are still part of the program or are a student (ie getting to play a sport or go to school). Typically the settlement or future lawsuit happens after the students are gone. (Often some public interest group picks up the lawsuit and covers the cost.)

Having said all that, this case itself started after the students are gone and focuses on retaliation. That may be something to watch.
Wilmer1

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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyGrayce
Wilmer right out of the gate with the denigrating "they are doing it for the money" muse? Alrighty then.

Ha ha.  Just because I asked a question that I am sure many are also thinking, I am denigrating women? How about you putting away your pacifier and thinking like an adult for once in your life.
TerpAlum

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W:

You are turning it into a personal vendetta with monetary rewards as the motivation without understanding the process. I admit I don't understand all of it myself, but come on...

Wilmer1

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
Doni Sanders?


D.J. Sanders actual name is Doni Jenee Sanders. 
EarlyGrayce

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilmer1

Ha ha.  Just because I asked a question that I am sure many are also thinking, I am denigrating women? How about you putting away your pacifier and thinking like an adult for once in your life.



Tap the brakes, wilma. No mention or inference  of women in my post. You got excited, then confused. Let me help. You impugned the motives of the complaint filers. 

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"What questions are not getting answered.  The only ones I see being avoided is "Why you switch from Dewey to Will I Wynn?"  and  "Why you switch from Bama_CF to Fresh?" and of course the best one that will never get answered, never in a million years... "When you bringing back KPI?"

Wilmer1

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpAlum

W:

You are turning it into a personal vendetta with monetary rewards as the motivation without understanding the process. I admit I don't understand all of it myself, but come on...



No, I am trying to figure out the end game in all of this.  The stadium they play in is one of the nicest in the country with a top notch hitting facility attached to it.  So scratch that as an issue.  I have seen pictures of their locker room and it is extremely nice.  So scratch that as an issue.  Lotief wasn't denied 2 paid assistants and a volunteer assistant.  So scratch that as an issue.  I saw the video of the press conference for the attorney representing the players in their complaint and she focused on the fact that the softball team lacked a full time trainer when the boys baseball team had one.  Ok, if true, that's an issue.  She also referred to the grass at the field not being timely cut.  Ok, if true, that's an issue. She also talked about the girls being locked out of the locker room immediately after Lotief was fired.  Since they fired him for cause, I would assume that the administration wanted to make sure that there was nothing in the locker room that might have supported their reason for firing Lotief so they locked the door while they checked the locker room.  It was my understanding that the locker room was opened the next day to the players.  So scratch that as an issue.  The lawyer admitted that she was being paid by alumni who were unhappy that Lotief got fired.  Is it possible that this could be some vendetta by the alumni/players to exact some measure of revenge against the university?  Would monetary damages be one way to exact revenge?
Softball98mom

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The new coach is mentioned in complaint, problems already. Ruh roh
3leftturns

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilmer1


D.J. Sanders actual name is Doni Jenee Sanders. 
The RESPONSE was to a post where the only recognized players were Craighton and Denham
Wilmer1

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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlyGrayce



Tap the brakes, wilma. No mention or inference  of women in my post. You got excited, then confused. Let me help. You impugned the motives of the complaint filers. 

LOL.  Your reading comprehension skills mirror that of your intelligence.  I ask that you take off your pink hat and re-read my post.  I was simply trying to figure what the complainants are hoping to accomplish with the filing of this complaint.  It certainly isn't out of the realm to think that the hope of some type of monetary payoff to just go away is not a logical thought.  Happens everyday in the real world.  None of the complainants even play for the university anymore.  Are they doing it so that future players won't have to endure the discrimination that they are alleging? We already know that the attorney that is representing them isn't doing this pro bono.

Lastly, you seek to set yourself up as some paragon of virtue but you intentionally attempt to denigrate me by purposely spelling my name incorrectly. Nice.
TerpAlum

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Wilmer-

The pink hat comments shows you are trying to impugn them. Look the law up. The players are not going to get some windfall because you see lawyer ads on tv and that is all you know about the law.

And even if there are no found violations, retaliation is a separate complaint. One complaint I read about took almost 10 years to adjudicate. A typical case takes about half that time. That is a long time to wait for a "pay off." The schools have lawyers on staff and lots of admin people whose job it is to fight these things.

Maybe the guy involved, Lotief, will get a pay off for his "back pay," but not the students.

Damages can go to the government as a fine against the university, you know.
1janiedough

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
Doni Sanders?
I forgot to add SandersđŸ˜‹
Sec_fan91

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They just need to move on. Loteif showed his true colors over and over again
1janiedough

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sec_fan91
They just need to move on. Loteif showed his true colors over and over again


Yes he did, didn't he?  What an odd little cult figure he was at ULL.
Mark_H

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Reply with quote  #19 
Can someone list the coaches who have had their similar size mid major schools ranked as consistently high for as long as the Lotiefs? I'm sure there must be others. Help me out here.
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Mark H
Webfoot

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So does this hurt the program in recruiting regardless of what comes out?
CajunAmos

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_H
Can someone list the coaches who have had their similar size mid major schools ranked as consistently high for as long as the Lotiefs? I'm sure there must be others. Help me out here.


Yvette?
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #22 
I just do not see how they get Loteif back at this point.

The rest of the 'complaints' seem pretty minor. 

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Just say no to dullards.   
Mark_H

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunAmos


Yvette?
B4 my time. How were their national rankings under her compared to the Lotiefs?

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Mark H
CW_Angel

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Reply with quote  #24 
https://katc.com/news/2018/09/14/former-ragin-cajuns-softball-players-allege-racism-sexual-harassment-in-title-ix-complaints/

Zero skin in this particular game, but reading the individual players' complaints (included at the bottom the katc.com page) was interesting. You expect the complaints about race, gender and sexual orientation discrimination, but this is the first time I've seen complaints of harassment/discrimination for being heterosexual. Was surprised that players names weren't redacted in the complaints.
TerpAlum

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Reply with quote  #25 
The athlete complaints are heart breaking. Glasco really could have handled this better. He knew coming in that ULL's roster was large. You have to know there is chaos and issues when a coach is booted and holds a press conference with some of the players. How about Glasco restoring some normalcy by not allowing your behavior to contribute and make it worse?

I hear of this relegating to catching fly balls during hitting practice happens; and that players don't get any reps in practice, based simply on the whims of the coach and being in the clique. (Then trying to make them team lackey managers or treat them like lackeys.) This needs to stop. If you can't handle the roster size (or evaluate kids fairly for remaining on the roster), then don't take the job there. If the kids then and only then don't pass muster, help them find another school. Instead, Glasco thinks he is a king--you know it's only a game and you can do these things in humane ways.
CajunAmos

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Reply with quote  #26 
I will say that if this proceeds to an actual courtroom you can't know which directions the questions about accusations may go about a persons personal life and history may go once you're on the witness stand. I wouldn't think anyone would want an under oath questioning. You could have former teammates with differing views of the same events.
TerpAlum

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Reply with quote  #27 
This is a complaint, not a lawsuit. A next step is that the Federal Government, if they choose, will investigate to see if the discrimination exists, a slow process. Then they will try and mediate the complaint with the school. If someone ends up in a courtroom it would have to be criminal charges (for what some wrote as an incident of assault) or some other form of litigation (Lotief for example, wrongful termination). All administrative remedies have to be completed prior to the complaint ever becoming a lawsuit. For students, there is little gain and a lot of expense in suing your school, let's say 4-5 years down the road (and the reason they would do so is the government differed with them and said there was no discrimination). Think about it; almost zero chance of hitting the courtroom. Now coaches who got fired have a better shot through the AAUW, etc., paying the bills, and the possibility of back pay.
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #28 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpAlum
The athlete complaints are heart breaking. Glasco really could have handled this better. He knew coming in that ULL's roster was large. You have to know there is chaos and issues when a coach is booted and holds a press conference with some of the players. How about Glasco restoring some normalcy by not allowing your behavior to contribute and make it worse?

I hear of this relegating to catching fly balls during hitting practice happens; and that players don't get any reps in practice, based simply on the whims of the coach and being in the clique. (Then trying to make them team lackey managers or treat them like lackeys.) This needs to stop. If you can't handle the roster size (or evaluate kids fairly for remaining on the roster), then don't take the job there. If the kids then and only then don't pass muster, help them find another school. Instead, Glasco thinks he is a king--you know it's only a game and you can do these things in humane ways.


So softball should be coached differently than other sports?
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #29 
No it just shouldn't be coached by men
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CajunAmos

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Reply with quote  #30 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpAlum
The athlete complaints are heart breaking. Glasco really could have handled this better. He knew coming in that ULL's roster was large. You have to know there is chaos and issues when a coach is booted and holds a press conference with some of the players. How about Glasco restoring some normalcy by not allowing your behavior to contribute and make it worse?

I hear of this relegating to catching fly balls during hitting practice happens; and that players don't get any reps in practice, based simply on the whims of the coach and being in the clique. (Then trying to make them team lackey managers or treat them like lackeys.) This needs to stop. If you can't handle the roster size (or evaluate kids fairly for remaining on the roster), then don't take the job there. If the kids then and only then don't pass muster, help them find another school. Instead, Glasco thinks he is a king--you know it's only a game and you can do these things in humane ways.


He did speak about this. He said he wouldn't continue the process of bringing the whole roster on road trips when only 25 would be available for actual play. I would assume those left behind knew they needed additional work to make the travel roster. I wouldn't call it a whim as it would be foolish of a coach to evaluate players, make a decision on your top 25, and then not concentrate on those players who you actually expect to play in the games. I would think every team sport prioritizes getting more reps for the players you expect to play. I've also seen plenty of catching fly balls during hitting work with every coach where I've watched practices.
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