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woody

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Talked with a Gentleman I do construction work for today. He said he was in meetings with planners to adapt to the new Obamacare regs. I remarked, what do you mean, do you show more than 49 employees on your books? Yes he said, I have 146 on the books. He told me that in the past, that he had offered a health plan, and that to a person, all those that were 30+, or so, with family, got on board, a larger percentage of employees in the 20-30 year bracket, thought it was great idea as well. However, the younger crowd started screaming when $25 a week was deducted from their checks. How can an employer compel it's employees to take care of themselves, when the government will subsidize them in an emergency? Meanwhile, the employer is penalized (taxed) for not providing a plan? This guy is trying to figure out if he should write a penalty check to Obamacare for 250K, or get some crap insurance plan spawned by the Obamacare act, and let the government screw his employees.
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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

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GrizzlyFan

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Reply with quote  #2 
Boortz was talking about a guy he knows that owns a business with over 50 employees. After the election, he fired 7 of them to get below 49. Coincidentally, the 7 that he fired were the ones with Obama bumper stickers on their cars. 
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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
woody

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Reply with quote  #3 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzlyFan
Boortz was talking about a guy he knows that owns a business with over 50 employees. After the election, he fired 7 of them to get below 49. Coincidentally, the 7 that he fired were the ones with Obama bumper stickers on their cars. 


I call Colonel BS. But then again, if a company is at the 50 employee threshold, this is a no brainer. My thought as an employer wishing to not fire my valued employees, is to reduce non essential staff to part time, and enhance the benefits of essential employees. What? Is this not the outcome the leftist expected? Did you read the whole law, before you rammed it through? Enjoy the stock market reaction to the election. Hows that 401K doing? Suckers.

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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #4 
The new norm of the land will probably be 24 to 28 hours but have heard the law has some penalties attached to 28 hrs in some places of the law.  Talk about creating haves and have nots and dependency.  Love that Socialist/communist state.  People are so stupid. Wonder how far down we will have to go before people will wise up.  
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Susan
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #5 
This is a perfect example of what I said Obamacare would do to business and this country to totally force govt healthcare.  People get laid off, have to go on govt healthcare ( 70 million already on medicaid and thats before Obamas expanded rule of 133% of poverty which will put millions more on in 2013).  This is all before Obamacare kicks in really.  A very sad state.  

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/how-many-businesses-have-announced-closings-or-lay-offs-since-obama-won-a-second-term/


Listening to obamas class warfare address to the nation right now.  Really sad!   Here we go.

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Susan
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #6 
Obamacare creating even more division and haves and havenots.

http://www.bit.ly/X79tqu



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Susan
StringerBell

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Reply with quote  #7 
There you go, blame the President, not the people making all of the money off of the sweat of others! Obamacare isn't creating the division. The haves are creating the division, and using Obamacare as the vehicle to get over.
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I love this game!
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #8 
By the way didn't Mrs. Clinton wanted a healthcare as Obama's when her husband was the president.??
it never got anywhere.
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #9 
Obama in 4 years:

"Eight years ago we inherited the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression.  We've made progress in digging out of the hole created by the Bush Administration but we have more to do.  That's why it is so important that we pass this Constitutional Amendment to increase the number of terms a president may serve so that I can personally, with my unparalleled brilliance, get the unemployment rate below 8%, so that we can get gas prices down to under $5 a gallon, so that we can continue to invest in alternative energy companies, one of which has to end up not going bankrupt.  Besides, Iran has threatened to launch all of their nuclear weapons if I am not re-elected."
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #10 
pabar61. you got my vote. if you give me a high paying job.
actually the economy started going down the drain in late 2008 and early 2009.
in 2008 most engineering companies had so much work that they had to ask retirees to come back to work. it was 2009 that mmost of them got laid off because most companies moved to india or overseas.
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #11 
Let's not forget that the financial meltdown was not caused by Bush or Republicans.  Blame should be squarely placed on the shoulders of Barney Frank and Christopher Dodd who singlehandedly created an enormous housing bubble by insisting that people who can't afford houses should be able to buy them anyway.  As a result of this attempt at "fairness", lending standards were dramatically relaxed, a whole new wave of "buyers" entered the market, and the market reacted accordingly by driving up housing prices based on this false demand.  Why the financial institutions went along like lemings is anyone's guess.  Many people got rich off this false economy, not the least of whom was Franklin Raines who oversaw the sham that was Fannie Mae.
bluedog

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Reply with quote  #12 
Another example of billionaires who have bought our Government....Theses same billionaires are encouraging unrest in the Middle East as we speak....You can believe Benghazi is part of the process.....Hamas and Israel...Iran, too.....They make big, big money off wars....They won't let things go very long without a war somewhere involving us, or one of our allies.... 
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pabar61
Let's not forget that the financial meltdown was not caused by Bush or Republicans.  Blame should be squarely placed on the shoulders of Barney Frank and Christopher Dodd who singlehandedly created an enormous housing bubble by insisting that people who can't afford houses should be able to buy them anyway.  As a result of this attempt at "fairness", lending standards were dramatically relaxed, a whole new wave of "buyers" entered the market, and the market reacted accordingly by driving up housing prices based on this false demand.  Why the financial institutions went along like lemings is anyone's guess.  Many people got rich off this false economy, not the least of whom was Franklin Raines who oversaw the sham that was Fannie Mae.

No, it was the "predatory lending" of those evil banks forcing people to buy homes they couldn't afford and then finding a way to get those bad debts off of their books so the regulators wouldn't come down on them.
insert sarcasm emoticon here

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#SCOTUS
Dewey

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Reply with quote  #14 
pabar - You're not going to tell our readers that Congressmen can make laws and rules on their own without a President's signature, are you?  If this were the case, McConnell and Boehner would have ignored the President and extended all the tax cuts long ago.  If you're still looking into blame, read this.
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President Obama kept Republicans out of the White House for 8 years and added two excellent justices to the Supreme Court.  Those two things alone make him one of our greatest Presidents of my lifetime.
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #15 
Pabar unfortunately too many voters dont give a crap.  Miltary fight for us, but their vote is suppressed the most.  Voters either have to be hit hard in their own family or status quo is ok. Because liberal media said it was Bush's fault and Bush was in office, Bush was blamed.  Ignorant, selfish, and apathetic voters put Obama back in office and now they will suffer the consequences of Obamacare, potentially losing their job, houses and then govt healthcare mandates etc... unfortunately the rest of us have to suffer for Obamas revenge too.  But, hopefully people will wake up and smell the roses so that we can have big change post 2nd term.  But true conservatives need to get rid of some old repubs that are killing us.
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Susan
DietCoke

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Reply with quote  #16 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbmom1812
This is a perfect example of what I said Obamacare would do to business and this country to totally force govt healthcare.  People get laid off, have to go on govt healthcare ( 70 million already on medicaid and thats before Obamas expanded rule of 133% of poverty which will put millions more on in 2013).  This is all before Obamacare kicks in really.  A very sad state.  

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/how-many-businesses-have-announced-closings-or-lay-offs-since-obama-won-a-second-term/


Listening to obamas class warfare address to the nation right now.  Really sad!   Here we go.



This is mostly BS.  Many of these companies would have had these restructurings regardless of who was elected.  For example, Energizer announced in September that they would restructure to cut costs & improve profits.  Global workforce reductions were included.  These were not the result of Obamacare.

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/energizer-holdings-inc-announces-preliminary-results-of-comprehensive-review-of-cost-structure-and-operating-model-2012-09-18


And RIM?  Really?  They have been on a downhill slope for the last several years.  Nobody buys Blackberries any more.  I really doubt their downsizing has anything to do with Obamacare.  Per RIM -

RIM announced on June 28 that it will reduce its global workforce by approximately 5,000 over the course of the remaining fiscal year. These are difficult but necessary changes to help achieve operational cost savings of over $1 billion. RIM remains committed to ensuring that the reductions made do not impact key programs such as BlackBerry 10, customer support or BlackBerry service levels.


Boeing has been on a cost-cutting campaign for the past several years.  Think the winding down of the wars might have something to do with layoffs in their defense division?  Per Boeing -

Boeing, the Pentagon's second-largest supplier, said the changes were the latest step in an affordability drive that has already reduced the company's costs by $2.2 billion since 2010, according to the memo.

The measures come as U.S. weapons makers are under pressure to cut costs and preserve profit margins amid dwindling defense spending in the U.S.

He said Boeing would cut the number of executive jobs an additional 10 percent by the end of 2012, bringing overall cuts in its executive team to 30 percent for the past two years, a move that would result in a 10 percent cut in management costs.

Boeing said the changes were not a response to the threat of additional, across-the-board U.S. budget cuts due to take effect on Jan. 2, or the outcome of U.S. elections, but represented another step in its continuing drive to "be more competitive while investing in technologies and people."


And the Providence Journal?  It's a NEWSPAPER!  They are all dying.  Magazines and newspapers are not only laying off employees, they are going out of business!  People are not reading newspapers anymore - they are getting their news online, on their phones and on cable TV.  They are losing advertisers.  Absolutely nothing to do with Obamacare.  Per a news release about the layoff -

The Providence Journal announced more layoffs as its circulation continues to drop.

The newspaper said Thursday it has cut another 23 full-time positions, blaming a soft advertising environment.

The newspaper reportedly bought out 11 other employees several weeks ago, bringing the total staff reduction to 34.

The latest round of cuts come as the paper suffers further circulation declines.

According to the Audit Bureau of Circulations', the Providence Journal's average daily circulation has fallen from 90,085 to 83,733 over the last year, a 7 percent decline.

The circulation number does not include abridged editions the newspaper throws in non-customers' property.

The Sunday edition is selling 117,784 copies compared to 129,024 the previous year, a 9 percent drop.



I'm sure many of the other companies mentioned in this article have similar stories.  The layoffs had most likely been planned previously.  The elections didn't matter.  A profitable company is not going to cut back just because of some additional benefit costs.  At least not one that cares about its customers and its reputation.  Did you see the backlash towards Papa John's when the CEO announced he would layoff employees and/or cut their hours because Obama was elected?  His company has made over $45M so far this year, he lives in a 40,000 square foot mansion with a 22 car underground garage (wonder if he has a car elevator like Mitt?), his net worth is $600M, the cost of covering his employees would amount to pennies of the cost of a pizza and would impact his bottom line by less than 1%.  Does he realize he comes off as a total a$$ by griping about this?  I suspect a boycott of Papa John's is in the works unless he changes his position.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/calebmelby/2012/11/12/breaking-down-centi-millionaire-papa-john-schnatters-obamacare-math/


A good analysis of the stupidity of the Blaze article is here -

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/12/1160651/-Debunking-Those-So-Called-revenge-Obamacare-Layoffs-w-Math


But I'm sure the right will keeping blaming Obama and Obamacare.......

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“If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.” – Dwight D. Eisenhower
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #17 
Dietcoke what do you do for a living?  Your insistence basically that Obamacare is not causing business change and layoff of people is laughable.  Have you read any of the law or its regs?  You really are on some kind of strong kool aid.
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Susan
DietCoke

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Reply with quote  #18 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbmom1812
Dietcoke what do you do for a living?  Your insistence basically that Obamacare is not causing business change and layoff of people is laughable.  Have you read any of the law or its regs?  You really are on some kind of strong kool aid.


Address the points made in my post, sbmom.  I dare you.

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“If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.” – Dwight D. Eisenhower
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #19 
Dietcoke I dont need to address the points I scanned.  The point is Obamacare is causing loss of jobs and great changes in jobs.  You are very ignorant about business and the law if you can not see that.  It will divide the haves and the have nots even more.  If you cant see it now you will unless you are a good little commie who just thinks govt is the greatest and all business is out to get its employees.
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Susan
mikec

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Reply with quote  #20 
Gosh, I hope this post is a joke. If there are real people walking around thinking stuff like this, then we're in worse trouble than I realized.

Ps- if you don't think that Obamacare is causing division, then you really are in some sort of alternative reality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell
There you go, blame the President, not the people making all of the money off of the sweat of others! Obamacare isn't creating the division. The haves are creating the division, and using Obamacare as the vehicle to get over.
mikec

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Reply with quote  #21 
DC - what is it with you liberals and your boycotts? Strike or boycott, always the first thing out your mouth.
ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #22 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
Gosh, I hope this post is a joke. If there are real people walking around thinking stuff like this, then we're in worse trouble than I realized.

Ps- if you don't think that Obamacare is causing division, then you really are in some sort of alternative reality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StringerBell
There you go, blame the President, not the people making all of the money off of the sweat of others! Obamacare isn't creating the division. The haves are creating the division, and using Obamacare as the vehicle to get over.


Mikec, you're catching on... Much worse trouble than you realized.
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #23 
Dewey, you act like politics don't exist.  Liberals like Frank and Dodd play the race card or the politics of division and bully cowardly Republicans into acquiescing to their liberal dogma.  I don't excuse the cowardly Republicans for abandoning their principles but it was the Democrats who led the charge on leading this economy to the edge of calamity.  The liberal press of couse went along with the whole propagation of the blame Bush narrative.
woody

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Reply with quote  #24 
Hmm, I have 60 full time employees, no wait, I now have 49 full time employees, and a bunch of folks working part time for me, and another company that now has 49 full time employees, and a bunch of part time employees from "other" sources. Or better yet, I have 49 employees working for company A, and another 49 working for a sister company, of company A, that was recently formed. Think the business world doesn't know how to work around a problem? Think again. Even if company "A" is forced to provide insurance, or pay a penalty, rest assured, the product you purchase from company "A", will reflect that added cost. Enjoy.
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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
Dewey

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Reply with quote  #25 
pabar - You're free to assign blame as you see fit.  The facts simply show the Bush Administration championed home-ownership as well.  That said, I doubt either Party fully understood the games the big banks were playing with the derivatives and the like that would ultimately compound the situation significantly.

woody - Businesses have always had the option to offer health insurance benefits and many chose to do just that.  No doubt they have the same option to take away these benefits and we'll have to wait and see how these decisions effect the personnel they're able to attract.

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President Obama kept Republicans out of the White House for 8 years and added two excellent justices to the Supreme Court.  Those two things alone make him one of our greatest Presidents of my lifetime.
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #26 
dewey your unbelievable.  I thought you were all about the little guy on the food chain.  The guys towards the top for the most part wont have to worry.  The guys at the bottom will get screwed by your nice healthcare.  Their once full time job, now becomes part time at best with no bennies and people get shoved onto govt healthcare like medicaid.  The young and heathy get screwed with less job opportunities and more being part time than full time.  And, on top of that they now have added expenses to spread the wealth on 25 to 30 hrs of pay.  I just hope most of the states design their own exchanges vs letting the feds do it.
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Susan
DietCoke

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Reply with quote  #27 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbmom1812
Dietcoke I dont need to address the points I scanned.  The point is Obamacare is causing loss of jobs and great changes in jobs.  You are very ignorant about business and the law if you can not see that.  It will divide the haves and the have nots even more.  If you cant see it now you will unless you are a good little commie who just thinks govt is the greatest and all business is out to get its employees.


Predictable response.  YOU posted the article.  I pointed out the fallacies in YOUR article.  YOU refuse to admit that YOUR article was WRONG.

YOU just fall back on your constant whining about Obama and health care reform.  If YOU are going to post an article that supposedly illustrates YOUR talking points, then stand up and defend it.

Problem is, YOU can't, because the information YOU provided is FALSE.  As is much of the stuff on The Blaze and Breitbart and FNC and WND and other right-wing sites.  YOU just can't admit it.

I am NOT ignorant.  I think I just pointed that out by debunking YOUR article.  You can call me names, but you don't even know my thoughts on this matter - NO, you really don't.  I addressed the article YOU posted, nothing more.  If you're going to post information, at least be able to show that it's truthful, factual, and relevant.  YOURS was not.  It was, at least in part (maybe all?) FALSE.  YOU - through your article - said the mentioned layoffs were the result of Obamacare.  I pointed out that the layoffs were NOT because of Obamacare.  Why can't you just admit YOUR article was wrong?

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“If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.” – Dwight D. Eisenhower
bluedog

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Reply with quote  #28 
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #29 
Dietcoke if you want to make it about the article, whatever.  My point is and always has been obamacare is costing  jobs, the middle class and the poor the most.  You got what you wanted unfortunately with your vote and see who is going to pay the most, the poor and middle class.  The haves and have nots get even more division.  Who you gonna blame this on?
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Susan
Dewey

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Reply with quote  #30 
Affordable Health Care Is A Job Creator

Will Obamacare Kill Jobs?  No.

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President Obama kept Republicans out of the White House for 8 years and added two excellent justices to the Supreme Court.  Those two things alone make him one of our greatest Presidents of my lifetime.
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