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woody

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Reply with quote  #31 
Come on LMSS, I know you can make it personal, I am standing just outside the circle of blood, and death, and am poking you with a blunt stick in order to allow you to unleash the inner beast. I know it's there, just go ahead, and go postal. Why risk popping an anyeurism?
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Lovemesomesoftball

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Reply with quote  #32 
C'mon Woody.....you know me........that is a bait post if I ever wrote one
jayrot

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Reply with quote  #33 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy888
I love it when people who live in a little bubble and don't have to deal with the consequences of their beliefs tell me its about "choice". You can choose to do whatever you want. I'm telling you what my experience is. I don't believe in legalizing marijuana because I've seen the effects it has immedialetly, short term and long term. I would say the same thing about alcohol, but i thought you started this thread about mj.


Are you saying that you believe legalizing marijuana would lead to more people partaking in this drug?  Do you think there is a group of people out there that is specifically staying away from the drug because it is illegal?  If so, I think that might be shortsighted.  In this day and age, if a person wants to do it, they do it (whether illegal or not).  Just like it is my choice to speed every day when I drive to and from work, despite the fact I know it is against the law to go over the posted speed limit.

It is a personal decision and some people will do whatever it takes to remove themselves from reality for whatever purpose (whether that be through marijuana, alcohol or absinthe).  And if you ask me, I'd much rather see all alcohol made illegal because of the people I've seen hurt by the consumption of alcohol (through abusive alcoholic parents, deaths on the road, and the latest deaths on Lake Lanier due to a drunken boater).  I mean if we are going to go the route of making certain things illegal because of the few people that use the substance improperly.  The government has set out a list of laws with regards to alcohol in hopes that the people will be intelligent enough to handle their inhibitions properly ... how is that any different than the legalization of marijuana.  (and if you need my personal background, I've never drank any alcohol nor have I partaken in any illegal drugs, but I'm quite addicted to caffeine in the form of sodas (not coffee or tea)).

I type all of this as I sit here employed by a company that was founded by one of the greatest aerospace scientist in the last 50 years (who even had his own cover on Times) and was a known user of marijuana because it "freed his mind to be creative."

Also, LMSS although the marijuana (not bath salts) might have led to the mentally disabled homeless person eating the other homeless person's face off, it does not classify as a death so would be improperly put in that original chart.
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #34 
Hadn't thought of this thread in awhile until I read an op-ed in today's Houston Chronicle. Don't know if it is on chron.com but I'll look for it later. Titled-----Marijuana legalization now policy, not just trend. Written by a 31 year veteran of DEA and 10 year chief of intelligence in the DEAs Houston Field Division, named Gary J. Hale. Very interesting take on someone who spent his life fighting drugs.

One of the most striking paragraphs starts like this
"The DEA is fighting an uphill battle by enforcing marijuana laws in the face of a new era of understanding, education and public sentiment, all of which represent a complete U-turn from long held beliefs regarding the substance"

IMO
Way too many people in U.S. jails for small marijuana possession charges, time for a change in our laws.

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pabar61

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Reply with quote  #35 
KIR - I agree.  My view is that pot is no more dangerous than booze and is probably less so.  Have you ever heard of an angry pot head?  Was at a concert last night and that familiar smell drifted by and it made me smile.  Unfortunately, not enough for a contact high.
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woody

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Reply with quote  #36 
If you want to smoke dope have at it. Want to shoot heroin, I say let the locals give you a taxpayer paid for hot dose and be done with it. It is your business if you want to kill yourself with drugs. Please just keep the cost at a minimal, so that you don't rob, and or kill innocent people in the process. Heck, I will give you the money to kill yourself, just do it quickly please.
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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #37 
One of the doctors that works at the medical practice my wife works at, had a home invasion yesterday. His wife was home alone yesterday, they live in West University. They rang the front door bell (that's where I grab either my closest pistol or my tactical Mossberg 12 ga. whichever is closest). Anyway rang the doorbell, as she was going to answer the door an unknown number of 'intruders' broke into her back door. She had enough time to run upstairs, lock herself in a closet and call 911. They heard her but were not there to harm her, this time. They rob the house of jewelry and other valuables.

Woody you know this is epidemic proportion in many urban areas in our country. We have limited resources in this county, this state and this nation. I would rather direct resources in shutting down car jackers and home invaders who support Sheila Jackson Lee than busting white, black, Hispanic or Asian dope smokers. We'll work on the wacky tobacky first then you can work on legalizing heroin

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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #38 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovemesomesoftball
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy888

Lovemesomeganja...
Thanks for painting such a vivid picture of your bubble and the people you know in it. While you are escaping reality ( for whatever reason) on a saturday night thinking about all the people you know in the comfort of your backyard, I am working on the streets of L.A. dealing with people I don't know. I've also worked some of the nicer neighborhoods in so cal. One thing remains the same in both...aside from meth heads, pot heads make up the highest percentage of burglars and thiefs in my experience. That is not hyperbole....unlike the stat you originally posted suugested mj is safer than peanuts. You talk in absolutes trying to portray mj as some harmless, garden variety weed found in everyone's back yard. Try researching the THC levels in today's pot and see what you find ( chemistry background not necessary). 
  You have the luxury of burying  your head in the sand......I don't.



Is your take ....because I advocate for legalization that I am lighting it up on Saturday night while you are out saving the world? You don't a single thing about me.  Don't assume because I have a different view than you that I am a bad person who is part of the problem and not the solution.

In fact two, three years ago I would not have openly supported legalization of marijuana. I would have been alright with things remaining the same. What changed my opinion were current DEA and law enforcement officers who are pushing for the legalization of drugs.



http://www.leap.cc/

I am not here to change your mind. You are a wall and will stand your ground on the subject.  Your exaggeration, hyperbole and weak shots at my character vs engaging in a real discussion might get a person who had no opinion on the subject, or or on the fence to research and consider the subject. I am good with that. I realize that there are some people for what what ever reason will never change their opinion. There are others who form their opinions  after looking at all sides. Legalization will not happen this year and probably not in the next five years but with more organizations like L.E.AP. it going to happen.




And two years ago LMSS also mentioned DEA coming down on the side of marijuana legalization. Since she wrote this thread 2 states have legalized and more will follow.

"In fact two, three years ago I would not have openly supported legalization of marijuana. I would have been alright with things remaining the same. What changed my opinion were current DEA and law enforcement officers who are pushing for the legalization of drugs."

"Legalization will not happen this year and probably not in the next five years but with more organizations like L.E.AP. it going to happen."

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JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #39 
The legalization of MJ is obviously not an absolute good or bad.  Thus, it must be considered partially in the light of prohibition of alcohol and then the legalizing of it. All I know is that, beyond medical reasons for which the effect is desired, ingesting into ones body any drug creates a desensitization within the nervous system, a system that often is a defense mechanism in decision making.  The "opening up of the brain for artistic endeavor" is merely a loss of effective social control mechanisms.  Does the word "impaired" strike a bell?                  

 The problem, as is true of any drug, is when the "relaxing drink after work" turns into a dumbing down of the person after his fifth "relaxer".  One cannot legislate human nature.  It seems to me that if we are going to legalize any "drug" it is imperative that the government pursue a mass education project concerning it without resorting to horror stories.  Like all education, some will better consider their acts, and some will not, but at least they will be operating with more data, and not just "gutter knowledge" or a blank slate.  

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BillSmith

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Reply with quote  #40 
kiir offered that: And two years ago LMSS also mentioned DEA coming down on the side of marijuana legalization. Since she wrote this thread 2 states have legalized and more will follow.

I would characterize LMMS' prophetic comments as one-small-step, but she'd think it teasing about her stature. [wink]

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mikec

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Reply with quote  #41 
May not be worth much, but mark me down as illegal.  What good is it to have a nation full of potheads?

People have no idea what they're getting into.  If they smoke, is it going to create an increasing desire to smoke?  Is it going to lead to heroin, or bath salts, or something that will kill you?

I guess I can't understand the need for this to be legal.  Other than some users making a lot of noise, what is the need?  What societal malady is this addressing?

Coal miners taking oxy in WVA has nothing to do with mj being legal.  That means coal miners in WVA need help and treatment.

I just don't see a positive risk/reward with legalizing it. 
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #42 
the reward is freeing jail space for hardened criminals and freeing police to stop pulling over otherwise law abiding citizens for small amounts of marijuana. we have home invader and carjacking epidemic in Harris county Texas and small time dope smokers are no problem to me. I feel a need for focused law enforcement. you can still drug test post accident as woody suggested for dopesmokers and/or not hire them in the first place.
if you're against it, you're against it.

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Lovemesomesoftball

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Reply with quote  #43 
Where has the time gone, it's been more than a year since I last posted in this thread.

keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #44 
"Good people don't smoke pot"
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mikec

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Reply with quote  #45 
boy, there are some oldie posters in this thread.
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #46 
Not sure why sessions is going after pot.

spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #47 
It’s all a big to do over nothing. Those that wanted to smoke have always gotten their weed. Those that wanted to be semi legal got their medical card and went that route. Wiith the legalization there will be an uptick in use by the ones that were to scared or to lazy to use the previous supply channels. After a while it will be back to the numbers of users before legalaization.
Don’t think the huge tax windfall will materialize. The curiosity sealers will fade away and why would people pay double or triple the price just to buy it from a trendy store.

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spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #48 
Or this happens
By SADIE GURMAN

The Associated Press
WASHINGTON — Attorney General Jeff Sessions is going after legalized marijuana. Sessions is rescinding a policy that had let legalized marijuana flourish without federal intervention across the country.

That’s according to two people with direct knowledge of the decision. They were not allowed to discuss it before an announcement expected Thursday and spoke on condition of anonymity.

The move will leave it to U.S. attorneys where pot is legal to decide whether to aggressively enforce federal marijuana law. The move likely will add to confusion about whether it’s OK to grow, buy or use marijuana in states where it’s legal, since long-standing federal law prohibits it.

The decision comes days after California began selling recreational marijuana.

Sessions compares marijuana to heroin and blames it for spikes in violence.

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bluedog

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Reply with quote  #49 
Sessions doesn't have a stake in the drug industry - so he goes after 'em..........

The Clinton foundation was his spending money for years - the Clintons are safe...............


uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #50 
Was not really a big supporter of marijuana legalization when it came to our state.   I also thought they should stop arresting people caught with marijuana. 

That is how it was when I was a kid.  You get pulled over by a cop, you have nothing really going on, they stumble around and find your quarter ounce.  Sometimes they did not even take it.  If they did take, they took it to smoke for themselves.

Only time people were getting charged was when they were selling pounds, or when they were doing really stupid other crap and the marijuana charge would be piled on to the other charges.

My main aversion to actual legalization was:
1) I thought more kids would be exposed and it would be harder for law enforcement to keep it out of schools. 
2) People would be smoking pot out in front of bars/restaurants and near open air dining locations.

1 never materialized.  Turns out security cameras have been a boon for busting drugs in high schools, so more than offset any uptick from legalization. 

2 definitely happened.  On numerous occasions have walked up to restaurant with business associates only to have to walk through marijuana haze.   Dude, no one wants to smell your stank weed smoke.  Even though 2 happened at the start, it has died down immensely, now that people are over the newness of legalized pot.

We should definitely not be filling our jails with weed smokers, that is a huge waste.



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Lovemesomesoftball

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Reply with quote  #51 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spazsdad
It’s all a big to do over nothing. Those that wanted to smoke have always gotten their weed. Those that wanted to be semi legal got their medical card and went that route. Wiith the legalization there will be an uptick in use by the ones that were to scared or to lazy to use the previous supply channels. After a while it will be back to the numbers of users before legalaization. Don’t think the huge tax windfall will materialize. The curiosity sealers will fade away and why would people pay double or triple the price just to buy it from a trendy store.


I want to smoke and can't get any weed. I am living in a state which does not allow recreation pot. I don't have time to grow it myself. I don't want chemicals in my pot so not going to buy it off some wahoo of the street. Some people want to come home and grab a beer. I would like to smoke a joint. It relaxes me. 
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #52 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lovemesomesoftball


I want to smoke and can't get any weed. I am living in a state which does not allow recreation pot. I don't have time to grow it myself. I don't want chemicals in my pot so not going to buy it off some wahoo of the street. Some people want to come home and grab a beer. I would like to smoke a joint. It relaxes me. 

There was always safe hippie organic types selling pot everywhere I have lived.   Surprised there are none in your area.

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Lovemesomesoftball

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Reply with quote  #53 

Quote:
Originally Posted by uwApoligist

There was always safe hippie organic types selling pot everywhere I have lived.   Surprised there are none in your area.


I have a mortgage, and a fancy tuition to pay not going to risk getting busted by some law enforcement agency to purchase pot from some hippie or a kid on the street. 

For some possession is a slap on the hand for others their lives are ruined. That is why I support legalization. I would like to be able to walk into an establishment and make a purchase without worry. If I drive, cause a disturbance or offer children my pot. I should deal with consequences similar to a person who abuses their alcohol privileges. 

 

uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #54 
I am not really arguing against legalization.  

I know in the 3 states that I lived in, 1 now legalized, pot purchasers were treated the same.  They were left alone.  Even if you were on scene when the dealer was getting busted, you were left to go on your way.

I definitely get what you are saying about not wanting the hassle.  If it is a really huge deal consider moving to one of the states that has legalized.  Part of the richness of America is the diversity of the states and their approaches.  

I suspect the number of states to legalize will continue to trend up.  NJ, NM, IL, MO, OH, and many others have passed, or come very close to passing various forms of legalizations.  CA, WA, OR, CO, AK currently allow most forms of rec usage.  

If your state offers medical it is definitely worth the hassle.  It is well known who the doctors are that willing to provide documentation to get a card.  Just tell them you are slightly less anxious and they will give you the card. 

If you are in a prude state, well my friend, you are going to be faced with a hunker down for a while scenario.  It is going to take time for this to play out across the nation.


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uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #55 
Also please make sure to join your local NORML chapter.  They are the ones that are doing yoemens work to get state legalizations through the process.   They were critical in WA, CO, CA, AK, OR and will be critical in the next wave.  

If you are truly interested in your state going legal, you will get active in NORML.   It is your best hope to make the change.

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mikec

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Reply with quote  #56 
Yeah, what the hell.  Abortion, gay marriage, legalize drugs.

Next, it will be mandatory French classes so we can more seamlessly blend with our euro masters.
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #57 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
Yeah, what the hell.  Abortion, gay marriage, legalize drugs.

Next, it will be mandatory French classes so we can more seamlessly blend with our euro masters.

No one said anything about any of those things.    This is just about potential legalization marijuana.  



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mikec

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Reply with quote  #58 
Quote:
Originally Posted by uwApoligist

No one said anything about any of those things.    This is just about potential legalization marijuana.  




those are the things you liberal libertarians have supported for a long time.  You support all 3.  along with your new buddy enptyheader, and your old buddy gracie.
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #59 
Mike - what is your thought on legalized pot?

As two of the more conservatives here, I am curious.  Do you think it should be a states rights issue?  In my older age I am leaning towards legalization.  You can find reports it's no worse than alcohol and would bring increased revenue.
Emptynester

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Reply with quote  #60 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec


those are the things you liberal libertarians have supported for a long time.  You support all 3.  along with your new buddy enptyheader, and your old buddy gracie.


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