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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #241 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhblue
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey
By the way, you didn't answer me when I asked if you believe the debt will be higher after Romney's first four years like he predicts?  He understands this will take time.


Dewey - Have you not read ANY of what kiir has posted on this subject?  Really?  I'm sorry, but these comments tire me more each time I read them.  Nobody is obligated to answer your rhetorical questions.  If they do, great.  If not, they probably aren't interested in the constant prodding.


Thank you blue.  I am definitely not up for the poking and prodding.  If I don't answer a question in 48 hours, it probably ain't gonna happen.  Move on to the next subject.  A question here or a question there ok.  But I am still not obligated to answer rhetorical questions.  I am more about the here and now, not the what if this and the what if that....who gives a flying F____ on the what if?  I don't.  I want the government to fix the debt now and don't believe in running up debt for debt's sake as Dewey does.

I say it is classic mentality of many in this country to live beyond their means.  Dewey says in his example that paying a little more on your principle,  you would "be broke and can't eat".  That my friend is overextended, just as our government is.  Can't pay your current bills? (debt), then quit borrowing.  I do pay more, many times throughout the year on my principle of my house and I would expect the government to be able to pay back debt in less time than 30 years!!  Maybe when Republicans with the help of Tea Party candidates get a super majority in congress along with Ted Cruz, Paul Ryan et al... they can teach them idiots that say it can't be done how to get it done.  Enough of kicking the can down the road.  Quit the BS talk of "It can't be done, it's too difficult".  If it's too difficult for some, then we have the wrong people in office.

Dewey, I was only asking you because you brought up the premise (don't know where you got the info) that we would go 25-30 trillion dollars in debt.  I asked you because you made the statement.  I just wanted to know why we have to go that far in debt?  I am not alone as you will find out in November.  If Romney-Paul win then they will be the one's grilled by the American public.  This is not a "pick on obama" issue, this is an issue that people want fixed.  No wonder the Congress' approval rating is only 10%.  You want to challenge every poster who wants answers because you feel they are attacking your poor obama.  Some just want the "living beyond your means" to stop in Washington.

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
Dewey

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Reply with quote  #242 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal

  I want the government to fix the debt now and don't believe in running up debt for debt's sake as Dewey does.


Dewey never said no such thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal

 Dewey says in his example that paying a little more on your principle,  you would "be broke and can't eat". 


Dewey said paying off principal in a very short term, as opposed to the traditional thirty years available, is much more damaging and unnecessary.  Actually, it's impossible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal

Dewey, I was only asking you because you brought up the premise (don't know where you got the info) that we would go 25-30 trillion dollars in debt.  I asked you because you made the statement.  I just wanted to know why we have to go that far in debt? 


The long term plans of Obama and Ryan both show no balanced budgets until probably twenty years plus, (Romney is hedging on the possibility it can be achieved in eight, but I repeat, hedging).  If we run twenty years of deficits, how high do you think our debt will be?  I did make an educated guess as to what that number might be but if someone opens Ryan's plan, I suspect you might be able to add up each deficit in his projection.

Again, these two gentlemen are telling us where the debt is headed assuming they manage to get their plans passed, (Obama too).  I just wanted to know what the Right thought about eight more years of deficits, even if they win?  Do they know it's coming?  Do they believe it's coming?  That's all I wanted to know.
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #243 


Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal

 Dewey says in his example that paying a little more on your principle,  you would "be broke and can't eat". 



"Dewey said paying off principal in a very short term, as opposed to the traditional thirty years available, is much more damaging and unnecessary.  Actually, it's impossible."

And I didn't bring up the mortgage comparison, you did...I didn't say 'very' short term, I said pay down the debt at 1 trillion a year [this is in agreement with the fiscal cliff debate]  That is not short term, that's 16 years.  You said it would cause all kinds of devastation.   I disagree and personally don't care what hardships it would cause.  We pay BILLIONS in interest and I see no need in more of that.

You did not question the 25-30 trillion dollar debt, you took it with a grain of salt and said "get used to it people".  That sounded to me like you were ok with running up debt for debts sake.  Your only 'fix' is a 30 or 40 year plan then I don't think that's good enough and there are many others who feel it should be done quicker.

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
BillSmith

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Reply with quote  #244 
"If you're on the fence..."

Wear a thick pair of denims, as the barbed wire is sharp and both sides are yanking on the posts.

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Dewey

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Reply with quote  #245 

In my mind, the term of this loan, (time to debt payoff), is probably 75 years or much more.  Sixteen years is short term when compared to the time it will take to pay off our debt.  There is nobody on this planet suggesting we can cut $1 Trillion from the budget so we can give the investors some of their principal back.  We'd go into an economic tailspin, not to mention many other perils.  If you want my opinion, if we went to $30 Trillion and never raised it any higher the rest of history, most would find that perfectly fine when compared to our GDP, wealth, etc.

The larger debt is inevitable, (not that I'm saying it's good rather it is what it is), unless we took drastic measures like you're suggesting which would harm us more.  It's time to understand there will be more borrowing in the near future along with a need to finance this out over the long term from the date we project a balance.  Like I said, I don't care what our debt is, (remember my post where I owe $1000), if we return to revenue growth exceeding spending growth as a percentage, the debt will eventually be paid off and all creditors will be satisfied with our direction.  I understand many on your side want it done quicker but do you understand why we still have such a high rating among most of the rating companies?  Because it doesn't take much for our economy to handle our needs when we put our minds to it.

slideby7

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Reply with quote  #246 
Mr. Dewey said:   "There actually used to be many more anti-Obama posters but I think some folks realized we were making excellent cases to the contrary and they gave up and went away.  Maybe they got tired of venting, I don't really know for sure.  Some of them were simply using multiple handles and they've reduced it to one."

I can only speak for myself. and I only have one handle.  I don't know why others left.  I didn't/don't find excellent cases being made.  I simply became tired of the repetetive party line talking points and montra as well as the constant accusations of posters having more than one handle and posters being told how to express themselves as well as having to read voluminously long diatribes.  It was really that simple.  Some of the posts by Mr. Dewey, Mr. Phoenix and Mr. JoiseyGuy remind me of the old line:  "I asked him what time it was and he told me how to build a watch."
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #247 
Quote:
Originally Posted by slideby7


I can only speak for myself. and I only have one handle.  I don't know why others left.  I didn't/don't find excellent cases being made.  I simply became tired of the repetitive party line talking points and mantra as well as the constant accusations of posters having more than one handle and posters being told how to express themselves as well as having to read voluminously long diatribes.  It was really that simple. 


You left out the homework assignments and the rhetorical questions.  Many reasons people left and the least of all would have been this one

"I think some folks realized we were making excellent cases to the contrary and they gave up and went away."

I really only see one left leaner making any sort of points, that's dewey.  The rest of them simply applause his posts, or make single sentence pot shots, or they link articles they agree with.  They depend on dewey to do it all.

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
woody

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Reply with quote  #248 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal
Quote:
Originally Posted by slideby7


I can only speak for myself. and I only have one handle.  I don't know why others left.  I didn't/don't find excellent cases being made.  I simply became tired of the repetitive party line talking points and mantra as well as the constant accusations of posters having more than one handle and posters being told how to express themselves as well as having to read voluminously long diatribes.  It was really that simple. 


You left out the homework assignments and the rhetorical questions.  Many reasons people left and the least of all would have been this one

"I think some folks realized we were making excellent cases to the contrary and they gave up and went away."

I really only see one left leaner making any sort of points, that's dewey.  The rest of them simply applause his posts, or make single sentence pot shots, or they link articles they agree with.  They depend on dewey to do it all.

Purty tough job, but Dewey has the time, and determination to carry the weight of all the Dem slackers on two broad shoulders. Must suck carrying so much water for a lost cause. The Socialist experiment is over. I am sorry for you in a way Dewey, with all the time and effort you have invested. It was on your part a valiant, yet futile effort. The adults are about to vote in November, and they will choose two ears, and a nose over your candidate. Maybe even a corpse.

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Rats flee from the sinking vessel. They traverse nimbly upon a rope, safely cleated to the dock, that is private enterprise. Socialism is dead, and tits up in the water. A bloated, death show, for rubberneckers of all classes to view.

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Dewey

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Reply with quote  #249 
Quote:
Originally Posted by woody

I am sorry for you in a way Dewey, with all the time and effort you have invested. It was on your part a valiant, yet futile effort.


woody - Who knows if you are right or wrong.  I'll be shocked if Democrats lose this election but, between voter ID and the like, there's lots to take on and maybe the results are up in the air.  In any event, no forum should let a President take a beating like this one has without putting up a fierce defense just like no individual should be battered without fighting back.  I have no apologies for putting out an alternative perspective on the many threads presented and I take pride in outlasting some of those who thought calling Obama or me names would drive us away.  Every time somebody gets angry at me for championing an Obama success, or for expressing some satisfaction I find in the direction of this Country, I know I'm making inroads.
sbmom1812

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Reply with quote  #250 
Dewey I think the only think Obama has to brag about is killing Osama and now we find out that even that was after Valerie Jarrett said it was okay.
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Susan
10er

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Reply with quote  #251 
http://wcfcourier.com/news/opinion/clayson/picking-the-right-rich-man/article_d8fa49d0-edfa-11e1-9f03-0019bb2963f4.html

Now, this is funny, but true...cuts both ways.

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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #252 
If you are on the fence,

about mocking Christianity and it's followers go right ahead, not much the Christians can do about it but turn the other cheek.  However, you better keep your thoughts to yourself when you talk about Islam, not so much tolerance there. 

Free speech, Islam doesn't believe in it.  So go ahead and make fun of religion, just make sure it's the 'right' religion to make fun of, if not it could get you killed.

__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
Dewey

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Reply with quote  #253 
We have but a few days left until the election so, likely, most of you have made up your mind. That said, I'll be a little more direct than some other members have been and simply say I hope you vote to re-elect Barack Obama. 
 
We now have a Country where preventive care is, or soon will be, available to almost every American.  This has been a great first step in both improving the lives of our citizens and lowering what this Country spends on health care annually.  Our health care expenditures are far higher than all other industrial nations and, from reports I read, our results are no better.  If we really want to address our high debt, getting a hold on these health care costs is essential.  More importantly, this new health reform has illustrated the compassionate concern of President Obama for those who remain uninsured or lack access to important preventive care.  Oh sure, this Country has always cared for people needing emergency attention but, by then, the damage is often done.  This President has made diagnostic tests, contraception, and other preventive health measures an important component of his new health reform, not to mention more readily available to all, and deserves a great deal of credit for the resulting life improvements.
 
Beyond these health measures, the President has taken important steps to improve the lives of Americans.  His emphasis on growing and improving the middle class, and his desire to make higher education available to all is something many of us can appreciate.  His support for gay marriage and his concern for the many children long ago brought to this Country illegally by their parents, cannot be ignored.  If it makes sense to you to stop preventing gay folks from getting married, or to find a pathway to citizenship for children brought to this Country many years ago, now educated and ready to contribute to the only Country they have ever known, then I don't know how you can fail to cast a vote to re-elect Barack Obama.
  
If jobs are your concern, rest assured both candidates plan to continue to grow jobs.  That said, the last Democrat President succeeded, the last Republican President failed, and now this President, over the last three years, has jobs increasing again to the tune of over five million, or an average of over 1.5 million yearly.  Yesterday, we see we're now up to a rate of two million annually and I'm certain over the next several months we'll increase this rate to 3 million or more.  There can be no doubt we are moving forward in significant ways.
 
Young or old, we all understand the needs of our retired citizens, and that includes this President.  He is fighting hard on their behalf.  There is no way he is going to place a large part of our debt on the backs of the retired by reducing their medical benefits and/or increasing their premiums to the extent Republicans want to take them.  I think we all understand our retired citizens may have to eventually bear a greater burden of their own health care costs, but most of us aren't willing to ask them to do so until we have a President willing to ask the wealthy to sacrifice too.  President Obama is a leader willing to do just that, through a partial return of the Clinton tax rates, as part of an overall and shared dedication to lowering our debt and balancing our budget.  I'm happy to support a President who believes such a shared approach must be part of any long term financial package. 
  
Finally, it's been a relief seeing a President winding down our current conflicts.  It appears he understands and agrees with a nation who has grown weary of sending our young men and women to fight abroad and he seems to give deep and thoughtful consideration to resolving international issues using alternative methods whenever possible.   I have no doubt this President will take the necessary steps to protect this Country when it's called for but, at the same time, he seems to have a sense of restraint found desirable by so many of his fellow Americans. 
 
As far as I'm concerned, the only thing to debate now is who will grow jobs faster and who can lower our deficits.  Here too, I happen to think President Obama wins but I understand some will disagree.  In any event, it's far too unacceptable, for me anyway, to disregard all the people mentioned above in the hope some prediction, that an unknown GOP policy will improve the lives of some others, should be given a try.  That's a chance I'm not willing to take, particularly considering the improved economic growth we are experiencing today, and I hope many of you feel the same.   Thank you and please vote on Tuesday.
slideby7

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Reply with quote  #254 
Mr. Dewey,  My mind had been made up, however I was so moved by your inspirational post I am going to reconsider.
BillSmith

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Reply with quote  #255 

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Sometimes you are the mole, sometimes the mushroom.
10er

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Reply with quote  #256 
Many laugh at the Republican,s talking about Obama's , " They didn't build it " comment that he made off teleprompter & now his  vote for me & gain your " revenge "comment, again made off tele.
Imo this is when the true Obama ideology comes to light. No matter how he spins it, these comments are what he believes- you all know that neighbor you  have down the street that lives in the big house. The one running that successful landscaping business. You know he didn't start it himself. Just not fair that guy making $ 251K a year. Join me & I will get you some of what he doesn't deserve...we will exact revenge on him.[ edit: this is a fictional story & opine of 10er, not intented to be factual ]

As a successful manager & currently owner of a PT business, I learned early on that a LEADER must delegate authority to others reporting to you to be successful. I think the president did a good job of doing that in order to move along his goals & policies. The problem is that he forgot the other half of the equation, you can't delegate responsibility when you do this & this president doesn't get that. He usually blames others for things not going as he planned or covers up for those he put in authority [ never to hear about it again]

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ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #257 
Quote:
Originally Posted by slideby7
Mr. Dewey,  My mind had been made up, however I was so moved by your inspirational post I am going to reconsider.


Me too.

That health care tax on the middle class and small business owners is the best idea ever.

And financially raping anyone who dares to be successful - that should be the American way. Hey mister, the government knows what to do with your money better than you do - why do you think they are $16 trillion in debt and you are rich? Because government has all the answers - namely, take more from the people.

And jobs, well Obama has posted the worst employment numbers in history, and to hear him tell, he's just getting started. Isn't that awesome?! Work? Why work when you can get enough from the rich to sustain your family a whole notch above poverty levels.

And the way he has handled diplomacy, bowing to every leader he could, just makes me proud. And what a great job obfuscating the bump in the road in Benghazi. So much transparency I'm nearly blinded.

America needs Obama because Americans have become dependent sluggards that are entitled to middle class livestyles because, well, because they know how to vote for the guy that will continue to enable them, using funds that don't exist. It's the new American Way, and you better get busy voting and filling out your entitlement applications. Go America Go, vote for Obama and get exactly what you deserve.
10er

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Reply with quote  #258 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachB25

Dewey presented his case to you as to why you should vote for his candidate.  I could not disagree more. Would you vote for a candidate who:

 

Said repeatedly that the Affordable Health Care act was not a tax.  Made that a point until the act was going to be declared unconstitutional and then had his lawyers argue that the Affordable Health Care Act is a tax.  Therefore, he knowingly mislead America and lied to all of us.

 

Promised transparency and failed to deliver on that promise.  The Affordable Health Care Act was passed behind closed doors and is so mysteries that even today we are finding out new facets of that law.  Remember Pelosi saying that we’d have to pass it in order for us to know what was in it?  Transparent?  Transparent about what he knew about the Fast and Furious?  Transparent about what he knew about Benghazi?  Transparent about avoiding the word “TAX” in regards to Obamacare knowing that not one Democrat is on the record for voting on this legislation as a tax!!!  … and he has the nerve to insinuate that Romney is misleading Americas.

 

Insist that parents can no longer make the “right decisions” about what their children eat at school and so, they will now force your child to eat what the government deems healthy.  Keep in mind that the reality of this is that the kids are not eating these items but instead are throwing them away and are hungry by the time the school day ends.  Also keep in mind that the school lunch providers have substantially increased their prices while at the same time making portions smaller to fit the requirements of the law. 

 

Has told various government entities to not enforce the laws Congress has passed.  Note his directives to those in immigration.  While the numbers say one thing, the fact is that most of these people being retained are not being sent back but rather are either being held or released to go about their business.  My Mother in Law and her father were immigrants.  They obeyed the laws of this land and respected the sovereignty of the United States of America.

 

Who’s jobs numbers are constantly being revised.  For example, the September numbers showed somewhere in the area of 170,000 new jobs.  However, the day before the Octobers numbers came out and without any fanfare, those numbers were reduced to 80,000 new jobs.  BHO’s man Goolsby even said that those numbers were “artificially too high.’  So, do you trust these last numbers.  Keep in mind that BHO is bragging that he has turned things around.  Riddle me this, if so, then why hasn’t he figured out that his numbers are not keeping up with the number of new people entering the jobs market?  He brags stats that show overall that he is falling behind?

 

For a candidate that has told the Catholic Church that they must abandon their beliefs in order to meet his mandate?  Regardless of what you want to say about Catholic women and their use of contraceptives, the Church itself if being attacked by this administration in the guise of “women’s rights.”

 

For a guy who has increased the national debt by 6 trillion dollars?  Oh, Dewey and others will say that he didn’t know how bad it was.  He made a pledge, campaigned on that pledge and told us he was the man to fix it.  Then, he pushed his health care agenda while at the same time spending us into more debt and then blamed Bush all the while.

 

For a man who has been the most divisive President of all time?  He refuses to work across the aisles and Obamacare set the standard for that.  Remember, it was passed on a simple majority.  Now he was voters to get “REVENGE.”  His words and not mine.  Revenge against what?  Well, imo, it is revenge for those who have worked hard and been prosperous to be successful and enjoy the American way.  He wants to REDISTRIBUTE THE WEALTH.  He has made class warfare his dogma.  If you believe in the working hard and earning the fruits of your labor, how can you vote for him?  Remember, he will be the first to tell you that “YOU DIDN’T EARN IT.” 

 

I could go on and on.  Vote for whomever you want but remember that we are a Republic.  The masses tell the electorate what to do.  We have had 4 years of the President ignoring the electorate and implementing his agenda or Wealth Redistribution.  If elected, he can get us to over 20 trillion dollars in debt and achieve his real goal where everyone will have to depend upon he government.  The wealthy will be taxed at rates of 70 to 90 percent and so, they will leave America.  We will be left with government handouts for our children and no American Dream.

Coach this is a very good post, I hope you don't mind me using much of it in a post to my kids & gkids & the 10 that I hope will be voting.

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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #259 
Not a very astute observation

Quote:
Finally, it's been a relief seeing a President winding down our current conflicts.  It appears he understands and agrees with a nation who has grown weary of sending our young men and women to fight abroad and he seems to give deep and thoughtful consideration to resolving international issues using alternative methods whenever possible.   I have no doubt this President will take the necessary steps to protect this Country when it's called for but, at the same time, he seems to have a sense of restraint found desirable by so many of his fellow Americans. 
 

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #260 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal
Not a very astute observation



This is why Dewey left.  There are so many posts of his that were completely and tragically wrong.  I knew he wouldn't have the character to stick around and own up to all of it.
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #261 
Originally Posted by slideby7


I can only speak for myself. and I only have one handle.  I don't know why others left.  I didn't/don't find excellent cases being made.  I simply became tired of the repetitive party line talking points and mantra as well as the constant accusations of posters having more than one handle and posters being told how to express themselves as well as having to read voluminously long diatribes.  It was really that simple. 


[CwDh1mzWgAA1GGw]

__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
keepinitreal

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Posts: 23,622
Reply with quote  #262 
Red team blue team
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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
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