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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #31 
I hear Philly, just like Chi town, knows plenty about handguns and where did you get that 411 masare?  I must admit, I really don't know anything about Philly's murder rate.  I do know that homicide rates, from everything I have read, have gone down in most of the U.S.




May I interject some facts to this thread that maybe some do not know?

From the website of gunpolicy.org, 2006 number of U.S. weapons were such:


Privately owned guns in the U.S.          270,000,000

Guns owned by U.S. defense forces         3,054,553

Guns owned by U.S. Law Enforcement        897,400

 

2006 numbers probably don't do today's gun count any justice but they'll do till I find newer data

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
GrizzlyFan

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Reply with quote  #32 
Quote:
Originally Posted by masare
Hey grizz the majority of Americans agree with dinger and don't know the real name of weapons with the exception of maybe handguns or shotguns.. Again you are in the minority ...that must piss you off so bad!


Mass Air the only thing that pisses me off about being in the minority is that the majority is made up of moochers and parasites like you and so many other government dependent people who can vote to take away the fruits of my labor to pay for your inability to provide for your own basic necessities.

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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #33 
Quote:
Originally Posted by masare
Hey grizz the majority of Americans agree with dinger and don't know the real name of weapons with the exception of maybe handguns or shotguns.. Again you are in the minority ...that must piss you off so bad!


Don't you love how the libs think that everyone must think just like they do?

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woody

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Reply with quote  #34 
Dinger, please read about an open bolt weapon carried by Israeli Citizen Soldiers. It is worthless past about 75 meters, but feel free to spout off with  uninformed rhetoric. The fact is, a bunch of Liberal Northeastern Democrats wish to disarm the citizens of the United States by Presidential edict. It might work in your state, and local community, but it will not work elsewhere. We will not let the Socialist take away our guns, we will not let them limit our 2nd amendment rights to take up arms against an authoritarian despot, and you can't do anything about it. There are more legal law abiding gun owners than there are army, police and government employees, now go pound sand Commie.

P.S. read what the state of Wyoming has done prior to a dictators edict, many other states will follow suit. 

http://k2radio.com/wyoming-lawmakers-propose-gun-protection-legislation/

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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #35 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinger
Quote:
Privately owned guns in the U.S. 270,000,000

Guns owned by U.S. defense forces 3,054,553

Guns owned by U.S. Law Enforcement 897,400


Not sure what your point is - but those numbers scare the hell out of me. Sure hope you private "oozie" owners don't shoot your eye out.
 


I also must admit, that I do not always "have a point".  I wanted you to form an opinion on your own.  All the research I can find is that U.S. homicide rates have actually gone down, not in Chicago however.   

Yes, we have work to do to keep crazies from having guns.  The horse is already out the barn there and needs to be corralled.  We are under the leadership of a bunch of fools in Washington but I think even they are smart enough to know that you will not disarm this country.   All I am ready to concede to this point is that there should be no loopholes from the criminal background check. 

Anyone ever try and do any hog hunting with a handgun?  I mean real hog hunting.  Didn't think so.  Great use for an AR-15 with a 30 round clip. 

***Pretty sure that gun number for private citizens is over 300,000,000 now

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
GrizzlyFan

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Reply with quote  #36 
Woody don't forget, these are the same pacifist wussies that believe that if the USA would just give up all of our military weapons, those that hate America will feel the love and give up their weapons too. And world peace would soon follow.
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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
woody

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Reply with quote  #37 
Quote:
Originally Posted by keepinitreal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinger
Quote:
Privately owned guns in the U.S. 270,000,000

Guns owned by U.S. defense forces 3,054,553

Guns owned by U.S. Law Enforcement 897,400


Not sure what your point is - but those numbers scare the hell out of me. Sure hope you private "oozie" owners don't shoot your eye out.
 


I also must admit, that I do not always "have a point".  I wanted you to form an opinion on your own.  All the research I can find is that U.S. homicide rates have actually gone down, not in Chicago however.   

Yes, we have work to do to keep crazies from having guns.  The horse is already out the barn there and needs to be corralled.  We are under the leadership of a bunch of fools in Washington but I think even they are smart enough to know that you will not disarm this country.   All I am ready to concede to this point is that there should be no loopholes from the criminal background check. 

Anyone ever try and do any hog hunting with a handgun?  I mean real hog hunting.  Didn't think so.  Great use for an AR-15 with a 30 round clip. 

***Pretty sure that gun number for private citizens is over 300,000,000 now


Buddy of mine just got back from South Texas from deer hunting. He shot 4 hogs with 2 shots from his AR-15. One was wounded, and he tracked its blood trail into some deep brush to find it. He said to his surprise there were another 50 hogs in that patch of brush, and they were not happy that he was among them. He backed out, inserted a 30 round clip, and waded back in among them. He killed 8 more hogs. Lots of "hog hunters" in Texas. Come get some.

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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
mikec

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Reply with quote  #38 
I think we should outlaw mass murder. If outlawing guns will help with gun crimes, then outlawing mass murder would surely work. Add some big fines - that'll be a sure deterrent.
mikec

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Reply with quote  #39 
I don't know what part of the country you are in, but down here in the south, you could not be more wrong.


Quote:
Originally Posted by masare
Hey grizz the majority of Americans agree with dinger and don't know the real name of weapons with the exception of maybe handguns or shotguns.. Again you are in the minority ...that must piss you off so bad!
woody

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Reply with quote  #40 
The fact is, the Socialist Democrats, including President Obama, Vice President Biden, NY Gov. Cuomo, and CT Gov Malloy, are among the politicians wanting to disarm the American Citizen. Please feel free to keep these traitors among you in the Northeast, and Sen Feinstein out West. You cannot imagine the outright rage of citizens within my state against these Socialist that want to disarm the citizens of our country. We will not tolerate your intrusion on our rights, and you might want to look back to 1994, when the gun ban was enacted, and see what were the results of the election that followed. Socialist can rest assured they will not disarm Americans, and they will have no effect on our Constitutional Rights. We will not stand for it. At least those non Socialist States that will fight for their Independence, and freedom from an authoritarian socialist government. Watch where you tread.
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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
GrizzlyFan

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Reply with quote  #41 
I am to the point that I would love to divide the USA into two countries. A conservative country and a liberal country. Which one do you think would prosper? Which one would have the lowest unemployment? Which one would create the most wealth? Which one would be able to defend itself? Which one would have the lowest crime rate. Which country would go broke? The only money the libs would make is off selling their movies and their pot to each other.
Hey libs you can have Granola Land (land of fruits and nuts) Californication, you can have the entire northeast. Take Illinois, Wisconsin, Michigan.

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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
woody

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Reply with quote  #42 
Draw the line, it is well overdue. Leave the festered, rusting Socialist to there demise. The rest of us would prosper in a free economic society, free from the oversight of Socialist, whom believe themselves to be more equal than the other animals. Come get some.
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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
GrizzlyFan

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Posts: 2,049
Reply with quote  #43 
For entertainment we could watch the liberals trying to plow their fields with electric tractors!
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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
woody

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Reply with quote  #44 
Or just strap up a few Comrades in front of the plow, and apply the whip. Government Mule, indeed. Some Animals are more equal than others.
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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
fhoenix

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Posts: 5,002
Reply with quote  #45 
I have not read, heard, nor seen posted or on tv any legislature propsed to take away guns. There is no new regulation that would effect me and my guns. Most guns owner are not effected.
Getting a gun will be harder and gun sellers are more accountable for who they sell to and what they can sell.
Limits on high-capacity magazines and expanded background checks. Tougher laws against straw purchasing with longer prison terms for those who buy guns for others (like those who supply gang members or people who cannot legally buy guns).

As a law abiding citizen the new regulation do not take away any of my guns. They don't take them away from any of my neighbors who all own guns. Living in the country we pretty much all have guns as we hunt as well as protect. All of us also served in the military. We are not effected at all by any of the things proposed. We don't have any of the questionable weapons. The complaints are expected...our society has groups complain about any and everything. NRA is going to complain about 2nd amendment being stepped on the same way many groups complain about 1st amendment being regulated. The same way people complain to the government to make abortions illegal and the opposite groups saying government should not step on their rights to choose. The 10th amendment would prevent the government from federal laws on birth/abortion (but states can make abortion illegal). 18th amendment was prohibition of alcohol yet the 21st amendment repealed it. hmmmm.

Passion for guns or against guns is fine....but there is no legislature to take away your guns. Even if new regulations come out they won't take your guns away (hence why people are buying up guns now that are on the fence for being made illegal). The questionalble guns are 2-handed, non-concealable, and are left in your home. Basically they are home security. And people will keep them as home security and they won't be taken away. You can't carry them around now. You won't have these with you at the movie theatre, sports bar, softball game, or while out jogging. Yes...they will restrict certain types of guns and ammo and make it harder to get guns quickly (or not at all if you fail background check because of mental issues, felony, etc). But the new regulations will effect illegal guns sales, straw sales (since they will track them better), care-free guns sales where they basically rubberstamp and don't follow procedure, and gun collectors. There were and still are gun-free towns, counties, cities etc....always has been even during the wild west when everyone carried. NONE of this will stop mass murders, suicides or gang violence. Gang members shoot and kill each other in chicago. Does gun ban and regulations effect them? No....Does being armed help them stay safer? No... Their ability to perceive a threat and shoot accurately at their target and drop the target before their target (also armed) drop them with their gunfire.
No administration will ever take away guns (no one can own any gun of any type and no one can carry guns anywere in usa). No one has proposed that and it will never happen.

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woody

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Reply with quote  #46 
Phoenix,
Question #1 Are you advocating the restriction of existing firearms laws?

Question #2 Do you believe in limiting the number of rounds a pistol may carry? Are you in favor of limiting the number of rounds a rifle may carry?

Question #3 Are you in favor of banning semi automatic weapons?

Question#4 Are you in favor of restricting the sale of ammunition, or the amount of ammunition a citizen may own?

Question#5 Are you in favor of registering citizens that own firearms?

Question#6 Do you believe the 2nd amendment is designed to allow citizens the right to overthrow an Authoritarian Government?

Very simple yes or no questions were asked, yes or no answers would be appreciated, without a cut and paste response.

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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
ForeverInBlue

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Posts: 9,838
Reply with quote  #47 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Softballfanatic
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey
Quote:
Originally Posted by LMUfan
   I seriously look for some executive decision within the next couple of years allowing him to extend his presidency more than 4 more years.


Another prediction from the Right that will not come true.  Will these ever end?  Wolf, wolf, wolf.


Dewey--These predictions by the general public on this forem are far less offensive to me than the outright lies that President/candidate Obama has made to get elected...twice!!!


Resolution introduced in house on Jan 6 (On or about) by Socialist Democrat from NY to repeal the 22nd Amendment which limits Presidential terms of office.

Important to note however that this whack job has introduced this bill several times over the years. Additionally many others have proposed similar legislation, including McConnell when Clinton was in office. So it seems fairly routine and a waste of time, at least so far.
masare

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Posts: 2,642
Reply with quote  #48 
Ah there you are...the haters are back! You know the ones who are for god, country, and guns? Not just god and not just country BUT god country and guns all three or they will hunt you down and shoot you! They are generally recognized from a special group of voters but I just can't remember the name of the group...ugh oh well!
GrizzlyFan

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Posts: 2,049
Reply with quote  #49 
Quote:
Originally Posted by masare
Ah there you are...the haters are back! You know the ones who are for god, country, and guns? Not just god and not just country BUT god country and guns all three or they will hunt you down and shoot you! They are generally recognized from a special group of voters but I just can't remember the name of the group...ugh oh well!


Ahh yes Mass Air, the three things that you loathe, God, Country, and Guns.
I am sure we could add the Constitution to that list as well.

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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
TheHammer

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Posts: 11,135
Reply with quote  #50 
i am certain that many of us would of loved to see our dislikers to be shot, but we ourselves are too nice to do that.  how about our exes
JoiseyGuy

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Posts: 24,434
Reply with quote  #51 
Coach B 25 - That there should be state militias (national guard) to prevent tyranny by the federal government and retain the rights guaranteed to the states?  Those powers not specifically given to the federal government are retained by the states. In 1776 -1781 those state militias were made up of volunteer ordinary citizens and in most cases the citizen's allegiance was to his home state and not to the newly formed federation, and citizens feared that the federal government would take away their guns and thus their right to defend their state against tyranny not to mention their hunting for food. Thus, it was necessary to give the right to bear arms to ordinary citizens and to insure the success of "The Constitutional Compromise" between states and the federal government as the federal government still did not have the complete trust of the states and the citizens in them. Does this scenario apply today?    Frank
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"Freethinkers are those who are willing to use their minds without prejudice and without fearing to understand things that clash with their own customs, privileges, or beliefs. This state of mind is not common, but it is essential for right thinking. Where it is absent discussion is apt to become worse than useless." Leo Tolstoy

"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
Wolfpackfan

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Posts: 1,918
Reply with quote  #52 
Quote:
Originally Posted by fhoenix
I have not read, heard, nor seen posted or on tv any legislature propsed to take away guns. There is no new regulation that would effect me and my guns. Most guns owner are not effected.
Getting a gun will be harder and gun sellers are more accountable for who they sell to and what they can sell.
Limits on high-capacity magazines and expanded background checks. Tougher laws against straw purchasing with longer prison terms for those who buy guns for others (like those who supply gang members or people who cannot legally buy guns).

As a law abiding citizen the new regulation do not take away any of my guns. They don't take them away from any of my neighbors who all own guns. Living in the country we pretty much all have guns as we hunt as well as protect. All of us also served in the military. We are not effected at all by any of the things proposed. We don't have any of the questionable weapons. The complaints are expected...our society has groups complain about any and everything. NRA is going to complain about 2nd amendment being stepped on the same way many groups complain about 1st amendment being regulated. The same way people complain to the government to make abortions illegal and the opposite groups saying government should not step on their rights to choose. The 10th amendment would prevent the government from federal laws on birth/abortion (but states can make abortion illegal). 18th amendment was prohibition of alcohol yet the 21st amendment repealed it. hmmmm.

Passion for guns or against guns is fine....but there is no legislature to take away your guns. Even if new regulations come out they won't take your guns away (hence why people are buying up guns now that are on the fence for being made illegal). The questionalble guns are 2-handed, non-concealable, and are left in your home. Basically they are home security. And people will keep them as home security and they won't be taken away. You can't carry them around now. You won't have these with you at the movie theatre, sports bar, softball game, or while out jogging. Yes...they will restrict certain types of guns and ammo and make it harder to get guns quickly (or not at all if you fail background check because of mental issues, felony, etc). But the new regulations will effect illegal guns sales, straw sales (since they will track them better), care-free guns sales where they basically rubberstamp and don't follow procedure, and gun collectors. There were and still are gun-free towns, counties, cities etc....always has been even during the wild west when everyone carried. NONE of this will stop mass murders, suicides or gang violence. Gang members shoot and kill each other in chicago. Does gun ban and regulations effect them? No....Does being armed help them stay safer? No... Their ability to perceive a threat and shoot accurately at their target and drop the target before their target (also armed) drop them with their gunfire.
No administration will ever take away guns (no one can own any gun of any type and no one can carry guns anywere in usa). No one has proposed that and it will never happen.
Limits on high-capacity magazines and expanded background checks. Tougher laws against straw purchasing with longer prison terms for those who buy guns for others (like those who supply gang members or people who cannot legally buy guns). I think I saw William Holder was on the panel. Does this mean he will be held accountable for the Operation Fast and Furious debacle?

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Go Pack!!!!!!!!!!!
Wolfpackfan

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Posts: 1,918
Reply with quote  #53 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzlyFan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinger
Another school shooting in California - apparently no fatalities - why? He used a shotgun and was a terrible aim - if he would have had an automatic or semi-automatic weapon with a large clip the results would have been much different. The point? There will always be crazies - there will always be bullies - there will always be anger - it just depends on whether they use their words, their fists or an oozie.


Dinger does the "oozie" shoot a slow stream of puss?
You are evidence that ignorant people should not be making decisions about the safety of the rest of us.
You don't need a Gun ban for a Oozie a good antibiotic would do! IMO

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Go Pack!!!!!!!!!!!
masare

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Posts: 2,642
Reply with quote  #54 
Grizz I wouldn't want to burst your illusion of me...hate away.  Your party is suffering because of this very focus I hope you realize that?  No one wants to take away the right to bear arms.  No one wants to change the constitution.  We are asking for reasonable changes for what guns are legal and what are not legal.  The more your group pushes for guns in schools and displays guns in public the more most of our society will want these restrictions tightened.  You walk around in public with your SEMI automatic weapon and someone will be walking around with a sign of pictures of the 20 innocent 6 six year olds that paid the price for your fragrant disregard to the safety of the rest of us!  This is a battle people are ready to have right now.  It's time to listen to what is being said and consider compromise on this issue...but I have little hope for that....so the consequences will be hard on you!
JoiseyGuy

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Posts: 24,434
Reply with quote  #55 
Hammer - I believe that you have put your finger on why I do not carry nor own a gun.  All except the ex wife part - don't have any.  In the service I learned how to kill people with "guns".  I don't trust myself to be prudent with one, and there are people I dislike.  
Frank
PS - For better or worse, I shall lean on the police to protect me and my wife.  

__________________
"Freethinkers are those who are willing to use their minds without prejudice and without fearing to understand things that clash with their own customs, privileges, or beliefs. This state of mind is not common, but it is essential for right thinking. Where it is absent discussion is apt to become worse than useless." Leo Tolstoy

"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
TheHammer

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Posts: 11,135
Reply with quote  #56 
Beleive me Frank, if you had an EX. you would know exactly what I meant, and realy wished you had a few guns, and knew how to use them.
BillSmith

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Posts: 6,568
Reply with quote  #57 

Frank-Kudos to you if you feel better not owning a gun for the reasons you listed. Doubt I'd judge you a gun-aholic, not able to resist the urge to kill, but it's your decision. However, equally, it's my decision to own a weapon. One not neutered to the point of making it ineffective. Hope the constitution is followed to allow such, despite recent rash misuse of firearms.

Regarding militia. It takes armed individuals to form a militia. That which was once organized by the states has been nationalized. Thus referred to as the NATIONAL GUARD. No longer for it's intended use. Reason alone for the rights of individuals not to be trampled, so that, if necessary, a weapon toting militia can be formed. You ask if it is necessary in modern society. I'd answer YES. There have been groups that have felt oppressed to the degree that they bandied together in mutual protection of their perceived violation of rights. Not always popularly supported like the Wounded Knee, Branch Davidians, Alcatraz occupation, Black Panthers, etc., however, it is their constitutional right to arm themselves in the face of what they view as intrusion on their constitutional rights. Polarizing to be sure, but must defend them if the door is to remain open for the day when just cause is upon us.

masare-I am in vocal opposition on this thread against the knee jerk reaction to ban certain weapons. However, I have none of the characteristics you lumped together regarding your diatribe toward those opposing gun legislation. I am not god-fearing, I am an atheist. Not too happy with what I know about the practices of my country. Certainly am not a flag waver. Perform a silent little protest unnoticed by those around me during a certain patriotic practice, but do understand I live in the best nation on the planet. Don't walk around with semi-automatics strapped to my body. Don't belong to the NRA. Guns are part of my past, not my present. I am none of what you pointedly object, therefore, I am offended by your commentary.

I support gun ownership and the right to own a weapon that is effective for the use intended. Killing people. Not a black powder Davy Crockett relic. There's lots of things unsafe in this world. Apparently chili powder can kill. Horrible crimes are committed with weapons every day. It is my position, that's a price we pay. Do more in other areas, such as mental health, but I am equally opposed to locking down our education institutions to the point they resemble jails. Poor message.

CoachB25-Well put. Except maybe the part about shooting masare. No UCS party at your house.

Sam-You are incorrigible. But consistent.

Dewey-If they rolled back the limit on Presidential terms, would you support it?


__________________
Bill Smith
West Bay Nuggets
NorCal Women's Fastpitch Summer League
info: nuggetsoftball@aol.com

Sometimes you are the mole, sometimes the mushroom.
Dewey

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Reply with quote  #58 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillSmith

Dewey-If they rolled back the limit on Presidential terms, would you support it?



Bill - No, certainly not at this time.  There is so much hatred for this President I wouldn't wish such an event on a 51% Country.  Now if our population swung widely in favor of a change in this rule, probably 2/3, I would give it consideration.  If we chose to do it with President Obama, I suppose I'd have to be packin'.

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President Obama kept Republicans out of the White House for 8 years and added two excellent justices to the Supreme Court.  Those two things alone make him one of our greatest Presidents of my lifetime.
BillSmith

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Reply with quote  #59 

I'd like to make it abundately clear, that while I support packing, I won't be rooting for the Packers on Saturday afternoon.

Regarding the 51%/two-thirds comment. Perhaps that is what would be best for our country. No term limits and unless the electorate could arrive at a 2/3rds margin, an incumbent remained in office. Just a thought.

Until then, I am still part of the NONE OF THE ABOVE party.


__________________
Bill Smith
West Bay Nuggets
NorCal Women's Fastpitch Summer League
info: nuggetsoftball@aol.com

Sometimes you are the mole, sometimes the mushroom.
Dewey

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Posts: 24,423
Reply with quote  #60 
Bill - Be careful how loud you say that these days.  Holes in the head are far less fun than on the head.
__________________
President Obama kept Republicans out of the White House for 8 years and added two excellent justices to the Supreme Court.  Those two things alone make him one of our greatest Presidents of my lifetime.
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