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mikec

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Posts: 7,848
Reply with quote  #1 
I am fing sick of leftists and their agenda here in America.

In what world is it ok to bash people for saying "my prayers are with the victims and their families"?  What aholes.

The POTUS and his lackey Clinton shoot all sorts of blustery BS relative to background checks, limiting access to weapons, gun show loopholes, and the like.  Guess what - these two terrorists in CA went through all of that.  Nothing that the empty suit Clinton or that moron POTUS had to say would have prevented this, just like the other mass shootings we've seen.

These lefties can't wait to jump in, while the bodies of the victims are still warm.

After 8 years of being accused of being racist, now this stuff.

These people don't give a crap about actually offering any solutions.  The only thing they care about is demonizing those that don't think exactly like them.

I am absolutely sickened and disgusted by them all.  How anyone can be an adherent to this Democrat religion, or vote for a Democrat, is beyond me.

While I'm at it - I'll add this - if you support Trump, and cause Hillary to get elected, I will hate you as much as I hate Democrats.

It is time to grow up people, and put adults back in charge.

[48977701] 
mikec

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Reply with quote  #2 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpAlum
Name-calling aside, the president and the next President (if the repubs don't get their act together) don't go far enough. Assault rifles should be banned. If you want to protect yourself or others, especially in public, I prefer you NOT do it with one of those. Plenty of short or other guns will do the trick.

The laws by themselves may not prevent a particular occurrence but it is easier to get a gun than to do many other things in life. Laws also reflect reducing the cost to society (for security, cleaning up the mess that results) and telling people what are society will tolerate (ie values).

So new laws will help remove the idea that using guns, particularly combined with anger, greed, politics, or whatever, are acceptable, which is the pervasive environment we live in. Some of the attitudes and pictures like above do send warped people over the edge.


I appreciate your relatively coherent response.

However, this CA shooting had nothing to do with the image above.  As my wife said, this couple was gainfully employed and had a 6 month old child.  When you are in that particular place in life, those are your happiest days.

Yet, they spent their time scheming on how to kill Christians because of their religious beliefs.  No gun control will help that.
bluedog

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Reply with quote  #3 
Quote:
It is time to grow up people, and put adults back in charge.


Mike, who gets to decide who is an adult?...You?.....No thanks!


Quote:
While I'm at it - I'll add this - if you support Trump, and cause Hillary to get elected, I will hate you as much as I hate Democrats.


So, you get to vote for Rubio? or someone else and lose to Hillary?....I see!
TylerDurden

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Reply with quote  #4 
MikeC - exactly right.  Liberals are for freedom of expression and ideas....until those ideas do not line up with theirs!

Personally, I am one conservative that thinks we can find some common sense ground on the issue of gun control.  I am in no way an expert on guns, and have no idea what certain types are legal or illegal, but I do know there has to be some common ground on this issue.  Republicans should not make this their "abortion" issue and refuse to give any ground whatsoever, and it would show the American people we are willing to come to the table.  Maybe some form of enhanced waiting period, ammo in the clip, or something like that.

I in no way think this will end these shootings whatsoever, but it would show some form of compromise on the issue.
bhblue

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Reply with quote  #5 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
The only thing they care about is demonizing those that don't think exactly like them. 


Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
While I'm at it - I'll add this - if you support Trump, and cause Hillary to get elected, I will hate you as much as I hate Democrats.
 


I'm no Trump supporter.  I'm just curious of how you can reconcile these two sentences.
bluedog

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Reply with quote  #6 
He can't!
pabar61

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerDurden
MikeC - exactly right.  Liberals are for freedom of expression and ideas....until those ideas do not line up with theirs!

Personally, I am one conservative that thinks we can find some common sense ground on the issue of gun control.  I am in no way an expert on guns, and have no idea what certain types are legal or illegal, but I do know there has to be some common ground on this issue.  Republicans should not make this their "abortion" issue and refuse to give any ground whatsoever, and it would show the American people we are willing to come to the table.  Maybe some form of enhanced waiting period, ammo in the clip, or something like that.

I in no way think this will end these shootings whatsoever, but it would show some form of compromise on the issue.


Perhaps the first step toward common ground is to ban anyone from a Middle East country to ever buy or own a gun.
ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #8 
No.
They take any compromise as evidence they are right and have been all along, then use that to campaign for even more *control.*
So no.

Just as bad is any assumption that criminals and terrorists will suddenly respect *new! Improved!* gun control laws.

So again, no.

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ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #9 
CAIR pronounced Farook a "good Muslim."

Tells you everything you need to know about CAIR, and Muslims.

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bhblue

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Reply with quote  #10 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverInBlue
No. They take any compromise as evidence they are right and have been all along, then use that to campaign for even more *control.* So no. Just as bad is any assumption that criminals and terrorists will suddenly respect *new! Improved!* gun control laws. So again, no.


^^^^ I agree completely.

Drugs have been illegal for decades with no drop in their use by those who want them.  People with dangerous lines of work like drug dealing, carjacking, and robbery will want their guns and will still get them.
mikec

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Reply with quote  #11 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhblue
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
The only thing they care about is demonizing those that don't think exactly like them. 


Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
While I'm at it - I'll add this - if you support Trump, and cause Hillary to get elected, I will hate you as much as I hate Democrats.
 


I'm no Trump supporter.  I'm just curious of how you can reconcile these two sentences.


Voting for Trump is a vote for liberals, and probably for Hillary.  I am over people who vote for Democrats.

Not so hard.
mikec

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Reply with quote  #12 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerDurden
MikeC - exactly right.  Liberals are for freedom of expression and ideas....until those ideas do not line up with theirs!

Personally, I am one conservative that thinks we can find some common sense ground on the issue of gun control.  I am in no way an expert on guns, and have no idea what certain types are legal or illegal, but I do know there has to be some common ground on this issue.  Republicans should not make this their "abortion" issue and refuse to give any ground whatsoever, and it would show the American people we are willing to come to the table.  Maybe some form of enhanced waiting period, ammo in the clip, or something like that.

I in no way think this will end these shootings whatsoever, but it would show some form of compromise on the issue.


The problem is that everything that they propose is already in place.  It's just rhetoric to inflame things, and pit people against each other.  It's race baiting for white people.

- keep guns from criminals - already illegal
- close gun show loopholes - has not been used by any mass shooters
- ban automatic weapons - already illegal
- ban assault weapons - already illegal (they want to ban things that look like assault weapons, but aren't)
- ban magazine capacity - is it going to matter that much if they have a 14 round magazine vs a 19 round magazine?

So, the only solution left is to ban guns outright.  I can't see that happening.  I think they know it as well.

Obama and his "common sense solutions" make no sense - they are all already the law.  He is a liar on this issue.  So is Clinton.

bhblue

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Reply with quote  #13 
Uh...okay.  In the interest of staying on topic, I'll leave it at that.
mikec

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedog
Quote:
It is time to grow up people, and put adults back in charge.


Mike, who gets to decide who is an adult?...You?.....No thanks!


Quote:
While I'm at it - I'll add this - if you support Trump, and cause Hillary to get elected, I will hate you as much as I hate Democrats.


So, you get to vote for Rubio? or someone else and lose to Hillary?....I see!


I must have forgotten to mention that I am, in fact, the Knower of All Things.

Sorry, should have clarified.  So, yes, I can decide that for you.
bhblue

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Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
So, the only solution left is to ban guns outright.


Make no bones about it - ^this^ is what they want.  Also make no bones about the fact that it will NEVER happen here in this country.  It's probably the Left's biggest pipe dream of all.  I doubt they could scrape up enough officers willing to go and take the guns from the officers who aren't willing, much less the rest of the gun owning population.
mikec

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Reply with quote  #16 
Lies, Lies, Lies.......

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/12/03/facts-shoot-holes-in-obamas-claim-that-us-is-only-host-to-mass-killings.html?intcmp=hpbt3


On Tuesday, President Obama stunned Americans and French alike with his false claims about gun violence in America. "I say this every time we’ve got one of these mass shootings. This just doesn’t happen in other countries,” claimed Obama. It is a claim that he has continually repeated over the years.

Talk about being self-absorbed.

The French have witnessed three mass public shootings this year. January saw two attacks, one on the Charlie Hebdo magazine and another on a Paris supermarket.

In the November attacks, 129 people were killed and 352 were injured. In just 2015, France suffered more casualties – killings and injuries – from mass public shootings than the U.S. has suffered during Obama’s entire presidency (508 to 424). This number includes the San Bernandino massacre on Wednesday.

In just 2015, France suffered more casualties – killings and injuries – from mass public shootings than the U.S. has suffered during Obama’s entire presidency (508 to 424). This number includes the San Bernandino massacre on Wednesday.

Obama also overlooks Norway, where Anders Behring Breivik used a gun to kill 67 people and wound 110 others. Still others were killed by bombs that Breivik detonated.  Of the four worst K-12 school shootings, three have occurred in Europe. Germany had two of these — one in 2002 at Erfut and another in 2009 at Winnenden, with a total death toll of 34.

Obama isn’t correct even if he meant the frequency of fatalities or attacks. Many European countries actually have higher rates of death from public shootings that resulted in four or more murders. It’s simply a matter of adjusting for America’s much larger population.

Let’s look at mass public shootings from 2009 to the middle of June this year. To compare fairly with American shootings, I excluded attacks that might be better classified as struggles over sovereignty. For instance, I did not count the 22 people killed in the Macedonian town of Kumanovo last month.  

Norway had the highest annual death rate, with 2 mass public shooting fatalities per million people. Macedonia had a rate of 0.38, Serbia 0.28, Slovakia 0.20, Finland 0.14, Belgium 0.14, and the Czech Republic 0.13.  The US comes in No. 8 with 0.095 mass public shooting fatalities per million people. Austria and Switzerland are close behind.

In terms of the frequency of attacks, the United States ranks ninth, with 0.09 attacks per million people.  Macedonia, Serbia, Switzerland, Norway, Slovakia, Finland, Belgium, and the Czech Republic all had higher rates.

There are two other studies on these questions that have gotten a fair amount of attention.

One, by State University of New York-Oswego public justice professor Jaclyn Schildkraut and Texas State University researcher H. Jaymi Elsass, who look at shootings across countries, has left out a large number of shootings in other countries. 

Yet, despite the extensive news coverage their study has received, they miss a lot of cases.  For example, in France, they miss three mass public shootings:

— Tours, France, October 29, 2001: four people were killed and 10 wounded when a French railway worker started killing people at a busy intersection in the city. 

— Nanterre, France, March 27, 2002: a man kills eight city councilors after a city council meeting. 

— Toulouse, France, March 19, 2012, Mohammed Merah killed four people (the killer also killed people in Montauban, France).

Other cases are missed in such countries as Austria, Belgium, Finland, Netherlands, Italy, Macedonia, Spain, Switzerland and Slovakia. 

It takes a lot of time and effort to find all the cases, but if you get all the attacks in the U.S. and miss those in other countries, it makes the U.S. look a lot worse.

Another by Lankford reportedly goes back to 1966, but while he shares his study with reporters, he requires that they don’t share it with researchers in the area and, despite the wide publicity given his findings, he has repeatedly turned down requests by myself to see his research.

The president’s statement was also limited in another sense.  He was referring only to shootings in his statement, but bombs are frequently used elsewhere in the world.

The Boston Marathon bombing was a rare exception these days in the United States. But countries such as Russia have frequently suffered bombings. Indeed, since 2009, the nation has seen 1.31 deaths per million from bombings that caused four or more fatalities.

Between 2007 and 2011, there was an average of 6,282 terrorist attacks per year outside of Iraq, Afghanistan and the U.S. On average, more than 27,000 people were killed, injured or kidnapped each year.

Obama keeps using these attacks to advocate requiring background checks on private transfers of guns. Such a requirement, however, already exists in France and almost all of Europe.

The background checks failed. So, too, did France and Belgium’s complete bans on the weapons used in those attacks. The terrorists who attacked those countries still got the weapons that they wanted.

Of the people stopped by background checks, nearly all are people who should have been allowed to buy guns. These delays may be mere inconveniences for most people, but they can endanger the lives of people who are being stalked and need immediate protection.

There is another common factor between mass public shootings.  Virtually all of the attacks in America and Europe are taking place where general citizens can’t carry guns for protection. At some point, it has to become apparent to gun control advocates that gun-free zones only protect the killers.

Can Obama actually believe his claim that these attacks “just doesn’t happen in other countries”?  More likely, Obama is willing to go to any extreme as he pushes for European-type gun control.  The last thing he wants to admit is that countries with such strict gun-control laws can have so many deadly attacks.

keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #17 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhblue
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec
So, the only solution left is to ban guns outright.


Make no bones about it - ^this^ is what they want.  Also make no bones about the fact that it will NEVER happen here in this country.  It's probably the Left's biggest pipe dream of all.  I doubt they could scrape up enough officers willing to go and take the guns from the officers who aren't willing, much less the rest of the gun owning population.


We all know that IS 'their' intention.  dewy was on the verge of admitting it before his tee-tee started hurting him.

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
woody

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Reply with quote  #18 
If I wanted to own an "assault rifle", there is a way to do that. It takes about 6 months to a year, mountains of forms, special tax stamps, and approval by the BATF. I know a couple of people that own fully automatic assault rifles. AR-15's are not assault rifles. AR-15s and civilian AK-47's are actually less leathal than my 7400 semi automatic 30-06 deer rifle. And yes, I have multiple 10 round magazines ready to rock. My pig gun is a 243 semi auto, but I am buying an AR-15 with multiple high capacity magazines in honor of all the gun grabbers.
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ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #19 
Vermont and New Hampshire, gun control laws are non-existent.

Crime rates? Virtually non-existent.

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woody

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Reply with quote  #20 
Lilly White privilege upper income states don't count. They are isolated from the lower social economic class by property values, and taxation. Throw those armed, upwardly mobile white folks into Chicago, and see what happens. I admit, it would be a really good study of societal behavior, and the resulting sudden carnage would be prime think tank fodder.
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Anarcho Capitalism. Get some, and no you can't have any of my money to live off of you Socialist Democrat.

"IT'S GOOD TO BE DA KING"
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #21 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverInBlue
Vermont and New Hampshire, gun control laws are non-existent.

Crime rates? Virtually non-existent.


Well then, obama will have to settle some manly, unvetted, refugees there to reverse the numbers.

__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
keepinitreal

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Posts: 21,987
Reply with quote  #22 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TerpAlum
Name-calling aside, the president and the next President (if the repubs don't get their act together) don't go far enough. Assault rifles should be banned. If you want to protect yourself or others, especially in public, I prefer you NOT do it with one of those. Plenty of short or other guns will do the trick.

The laws by themselves may not prevent a particular occurrence but it is easier to get a gun than to do many other things in life. Laws also reflect reducing the cost to society (for security, cleaning up the mess that results) and telling people what our society will tolerate (ie relative values in a group environment; we don't live by ourselves).

So new laws will help remove the idea that using guns, particularly combined with anger, politics, or whatever, are acceptable, which is the pervasive environment we live in. Some of the attitudes and pictures like above do send warped people over the edge. We love a vigilante, I guess, until they are on the other side of us.


[image]


[thumb][thumb] 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikec


The problem is that everything that they propose is already in place.  It's just rhetoric to inflame things, and pit people against each other.  It's race baiting for white people.

- keep guns from criminals - already illegal
- close gun show loopholes - has not been used by any mass shooters
- ban automatic weapons - already illegal
- ban assault weapons - already illegal (they want to ban things that look like assault weapons, but aren't)
- ban magazine capacity - is it going to matter that much if they have a 14 round magazine vs a 19 round magazine?

So, the only solution left is to ban guns outright.  I can't see that happening.  I think they know it as well.

Obama and his "common sense solutions" make no sense - they are all already the law.  He is a liar on this issue.  So is Clinton.


__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #23 
After the San Bernardino terrorist attack, California senator Barbara Boxer said California's (very strict) gun laws are working.

Just not with terrorists.

She also failed to mention that lower crime rates are not exclusive to California, but nationwide, following a trend of over 40 years.

She also failed to mention gun sales, which are soaring.

Hmm.

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mikec

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Reply with quote  #24 
So, Obama was calling for gun grabs within moments of this CA shooting.  Now, his FBI Director has said this is now a terrorist investigation.

Where the heck is Mr. POTUS?  Is he going to say anything now?

What a total di$~@^&*head.
GrizzlyFan

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Reply with quote  #25 
Every mass killing has one thing in common, they all would have suffered MUCH less casualties if the people that were attacked were armed. PERIOD
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If Obamacare is such a good thing, why did he have to lie about it to get it passed?
mikec

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Reply with quote  #26 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizzlyFan
Every mass killing has one thing in common, they all would have suffered MUCH less casualties if the people that were attacked were armed. PERIOD


I have heard several County Sheriffs today saying that exact same thing.  They were encouraging their concealed carry permit holders to actually carry.  One guy said that was the best hope of limiting the carnage.

In spite of what liberals have to say, the police generally are not afraid of lawful permit carriers.
ForeverInBlue

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Reply with quote  #27 
The female terrorist, Malik, was a Pakastani who came to the US on a K-1 "Fiancée" visa, which are approved more than 99% of the time.

She was vetted and cleared by DHS.

ABC News reports that the address supplied by Malik in Pakistan *does not exist.*

How did DHS clear her again? They don't even verify an applicants home address?

When Congress calls for more thorough screening procedures, it's clear that those calls are wholly justified. Yet Democrats scream "Islamophobe!" and other such histrionic nonsense, mindless of the danger to America. There are millions of people in the country since Obama took office who were cleared under this broken screening standard process - Even as the threat of terrorism has grown, unacknowledged by Obama and Democrats.

Does it really take an act of Congress to force Democrats to protect America? Apparently it does, but even that won't work. What we need is someone serious about securing the country in the Oval Office. We need it to happen soon.

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keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #28 
But yet they say they can 'clear' and vette thousands of male and female refugees that they know nothing about.  No thanks, keep them out of Texas, seems the politicians in California want them
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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
keepinitreal

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Reply with quote  #29 
Nah they did'nnt

Embedded image permalink

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"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
keepinitreal

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Posts: 21,987
Reply with quote  #30 
[image]
__________________
"I like to establish the parameters of my own thoughts and don't think I need a director."

"This is not debate class. And this is not about politeness. We're talking about the damn future of our country"

"It is not just simply yelling out a name and yelling down dissenters........................... and I'll defend your right to even insult me" 
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