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lovsofbal

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Reply with quote  #31 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RELAX
Are facemasks required on batting helmets now? 



Not in college..
Softball_rules5

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Reply with quote  #32 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovsofbal


Not in college..


No but ask the kid from Texas how she enjoyed missing the rest of the regionals after taking one in the eye after fouling it off. I don't have nearly as big an issue with hitters not having them as pitchers.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #33 
Agreed.... Unless you are running toward a ball (or you foul one into your face like Hosack), a batter has reasonable ability to have a pitch hit facial bones
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #34 
No evidence other that my eyeballs but I would venture a guess that more battters have been hit than pitchers.
I don't understand the make it mandatory angle. Nobody is stopping you from wearing it so why can't you, as an individual or parent, just make a personal choice in the matter. Why do you need the crutch of someone else making it mandatory for you. Sorry but I don't buy into the "if it saves just one" mantra
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #35 
It's not just one... I mean, it may just be one 'death'... but there have to be thousands of facial fractures in travel and NCAA over the years.

Hitters ARE required to wear helmets.... why?

And, facemasks are required by ASA for hitting helmets
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #36 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
It's not just one... I mean, it may just be one 'death'... but there have to be thousands of facial fractures in travel and NCAA over the years.



Hitters ARE required to wear helmets.... why?

And, facemasks are required by ASA for hitting helmets

Do you have any numbers to back up this claim? And ASA requires them for minors, with a few exceptions, I believe.
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #37 
My daughter pitched upper level d1.  Was never really afraid for her life.  She would occasionally hang a pitch, and I would give her a stern reminder that is a no-go at her level.  

Watched like 100 hundred pitchers within her age group that were her contemporaries.   Do not know any that wore masks.  They all got through 4 years.   Even though most college softball players are great kids, the risk of a DUI or early pregnancy were way higher than these massive concerns you guys are expressing. 

Agree batters are 10x more likely to get hit.  Even there

I can tell you straight up, beyond a shadow of a doubt.  You show up on the mound at the college level with a mask, you are going to be seen in a specific light.  Hitters will get excited, they will toe up on the plate, they will try to intimidate you.  Now if you are truly bad arse and plunk the first hitter toe'd up you can get the respect back.  In general the kids that wear masks tend to try to hide on the outside corner and pick that corner apart with placement pitches. 

Hitters without masks are generally seen as tougher outs, tougher kids, kids more willing to turn on the inside pitch, and reach the outside corner, than kids with masks on their helmets.  Just the way it is.  

High school this happens way more than college as you have truly rec kids, kids that have not played any upper levels of ball being pitchers.  Pitching to kids that are finishing off their HS years and going to upper D1 colleges.

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Softball_rules5

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Reply with quote  #38 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spazsdad

Do you have any numbers to back up this claim? And ASA requires them for minors, with a few exceptions, I believe.


Wrong, ASA requires them for all levels including Gold
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #39 

Quote:
Originally Posted by spazsdad
Do you have any numbers to back up this claim? And ASA requires them for minors, with a few exceptions, I believe.
I am just guessing it happens once in every state a year... Over 20 years, even that meager number would constitute four figures.

But, no, no hard copy empirical data. Then again, it this age of science being disregarded, what would that even mean

Softball_rules5

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Reply with quote  #40 
One less injury, one less season lost, one less career ended too soon. I played, and I'll say this-we are our own worst enemies. If you don't tell us to do something then the majority won't. Sometimes society has to step in for the good of its members.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #41 
Quote:
Originally Posted by uwApoligist


I can tell you straight up, beyond a shadow of a doubt.  You show up on the mound at the college level with a mask, you are going to be seen in a specific light.  Hitters will get excited, they will toe up on the plate, they will try to intimidate you.

Yeahhhhhh.... they are really 'toeing up' Kelly Barnhill
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #42 
uWa... I thought you were a Washington fan
redbirdone

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Reply with quote  #43 
The whole mask thing gets dominated in threads on other fastpitch boards by parents who want them to be mandatory because their kid won't play without one, or because of their helicopter parenting they won't let them play without one.  


rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #44 
Why do you object to the mask, when all of you hide behind one on this forum. I prefer one to protect myself from the idiocracy of you bad ass parents who are willing to sacrifice your daughters well being to show how tough YOU ARE. A pox on all of you.
1janiedough

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Reply with quote  #45 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
Why do you object to the mask, when all of you hide behind one on this forum. I prefer one to protect myself from the idiocracy of you bad ass parents who are willing to sacrifice your daughters well being to show how tough YOU ARE. A pox on all of you.



[rolleyes][biggrin]  lmao.
Fresh

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Reply with quote  #46 
The thought of a ball rocketing at your child's face is definitely frightening. My daughter pitched and asked me about trying a mask. I was old school and didn't really think it was a great idea, but found her the one she liked and had it on hand for the next practice session. After about 5 pitches she wanted to take it off and after 25 pitches she said it was bothering her too much to continue wearing it. I didn't really care if she continued to wear it, but told her she would have to get used to it in practice before using it in a game. She might have eventually gotten used to it if I had insisted on her wearing it, but I was more concerned that the distraction of the mask would diminish her ability to hit her spots and focus. I wager more kids have been killed from shots to the chest than from shots to the face. Never regretted my decision and would do it again. She pitched in the ACC and had 1 scare from a shot off the bat at georgia Tech that caused a gasp from the crowd. She caught it for the out. 
I don't discourage or encourage the use of defensive masks. Batting masks should probably be required as I've seen probably 50 times as many shots to the face off the bat than while fielding. Especially slappers.
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #47 
Quote:
Originally Posted by uwApoligist
My daughter pitched upper level d1.  Was never really afraid for her life.  She would occasionally hang a pitch, and I would give her a stern reminder that is a no-go at her level.  

Watched like 100 hundred pitchers within her age group that were her contemporaries.   Do not know any that wore masks.  They all got through 4 years.   Even though most college softball players are great kids, the risk of a DUI or early pregnancy were way higher than these massive concerns you guys are expressing. 

Agree batters are 10x more likely to get hit.  Even there

I can tell you straight up, beyond a shadow of a doubt.  You show up on the mound at the college level with a mask, you are going to be seen in a specific light.  Hitters will get excited, they will toe up on the plate, they will try to intimidate you.  Now if you are truly bad arse and plunk the first hitter toe'd up you can get the respect back.  In general the kids that wear masks tend to try to hide on the outside corner and pick that corner apart with placement pitches. 

Hitters without masks are generally seen as tougher outs, tougher kids, kids more willing to turn on the inside pitch, and reach the outside corner, than kids with masks on their helmets.  Just the way it is.  

High school this happens way more than college as you have truly rec kids, kids that have not played any upper levels of ball being pitchers.  Pitching to kids that are finishing off their HS years and going to upper D1 colleges.


That has got to be the biggest bunch of crap I think I've ever read on this forum. 

So if I read you correctly, Power 5 programs, in their weekly run up to games, studying film, breaking down batters etc...ACTUALLY apply some sort of metric to batters who wear face protection vs batters that don't?? And I guess there are also stats available to prove this insane theory?? 

And on the flip side, you believe teams who face pitchers with masks think they have an advantage?? Wilkenson, Barnhill...how that work out for your theory. 

Maybe it's just possible Pitchers wear a mask for safety reasons &, wait for it, batters don't wear face protection on their helmet because they feel it helps them see the ball better. 

Sounds like your "old school" mentality is in the early stages of Alzhimers. I give you credit for being original though. 








redbirdone

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Reply with quote  #48 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
Why do you object to the mask, when all of you hide behind one on this forum. I prefer one to protect myself from the idiocracy of you bad ass parents who are willing to sacrifice your daughters well being to show how tough YOU ARE. A pox on all of you.


Maybe some of us don't want to live in a nanny state where everything that is mandated is done "for your protection."  Personal freedom is a great great great thing that many in this world do not get to experience.  If you want your kid to wear a mask, fine.  But don't try to get my kid to wear one just so you think it levels the playing field.  



3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #49 
Levels the playing field??? Like wearing a seatbelt 'levels' some sort of playing field?

Aw, jayrot... we had the two seatbelt posts withing 12 seconds of each other and you bailed!
Dusty

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Reply with quote  #50 
Several years ago dw and I were watching a 12u travel game while dd was warming up with her team.  On another field a first year 12u team was playing a 2nd year 12u team when the sound of squarely hit ball followed a split second later by ball squarely hitting face drew everyones attention.  I knew the batter as she was a big kid power hitter who guest played on my older dd's 2nd year 12u team when she was 11 and the pitcher who got hit was tiny, even by first year 12u standards.

My dd was a 11yo 12u pitcher at the time and when you and your wife see somebody else's dd pitcher flopping around face down in the circle surrounded by her blood and teeth and then you see the helicopter land in right field to pick her and her up to take her to the hospital then it can't help but affect the decisions your going to make about your dd's protection while pitching at that age.  We heard later that the kid was alright, just lost several teeth.  

That said, I don't think the masks should be mandated.  Last year before a HS game my dd asked me if I would mind if she didn't wear it for a game because she had a heat rash on her face and she thought the mask would effect her concentration.  I told her it was up to her from now and she didn't need to ask me anymore.  I tend to forget about it and not even pay attention to whether a pitcher in any game is wearing a mask or not until it comes up because someone like Finucane gets hit which gets a lot of local attention since she's from our area. 



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redbirdone

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Reply with quote  #51 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayrot


Dang those stupid government mandated seat belts.


not disagreeing with this statement, but where do you draw the line?  Helmets for people in cars?  That would save a lot of lives.  What about mandatory exercise everyday?  Would probably prevent a few heart attacks.  And about a third of all car accidents occur within a mile of your home, so how about you have to park your car outside of mile of your house and just walk the rest of the way?  

I know, I'll probably get blasted by you and others...but at some point you have to understand the risks of the actions you are participating in.   
rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #52 
Aint it great to have the freedom to be stupid.
lovsofbal

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Reply with quote  #53 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Softball_rules5
No but ask the kid from Texas how she enjoyed missing the rest of the regionals after taking one in the eye after fouling it off. I don't have nearly as big an issue with hitters not having them as pitchers.


not in college

redbirdone

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Reply with quote  #54 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
Aint it great to have the freedom to be stupid.


I'm just going to step out here.  This is a personal issue and decision.  Just like some people choose to own guns, and others choose not to. And some decide to vote dem and some repub.  

Like those two issues, no matter what you decide you're going to piss off half of the people out there so from here on out when it comes to masks I have no opinion publicly.  None.  

Peace on everyone.
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #55 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone


That has got to be the biggest bunch of crap I think I've ever read on this forum. 

So if I read you correctly, Power 5 programs, in their weekly run up to games, studying film, breaking down batters etc...ACTUALLY apply some sort of metric to batters who wear face protection vs batters that don't?? And I guess there are also stats available to prove this insane theory?? 

And on the flip side, you believe teams who face pitchers with masks think they have an advantage?? Wilkenson, Barnhill...how that work out for your theory. 

Maybe it's just possible Pitchers wear a mask for safety reasons &, wait for it, batters don't wear face protection on their helmet because they feel it helps them see the ball better. 

Sounds like your "old school" mentality is in the early stages of Alzhimers. I give you credit for being original though. 

Just cause you disagree does not make something old school.

Already addressed the Barnhill, Wilkenson.  If you can prove you can get inside you will be fine.  

And yes, watched Wilkonson in a game.  In that game a lot of people crowded the plate on her.  In that game she was not getting the outside corner calls, though it seemed she was hitting it.  That game did not go well for her.  

Pretend that it is not a part of the game all you want, if that serves your purpose.  People are free to listen to you or listen to me. 

On hitters wearing masks, I was just agreeing with spazsdad.  My incidental evidence was that more hitters fouled balls off up into their face, or mask if they were wearing one by about 10-1 over seeing balls hit back at pitchers.  But that is just me.



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uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #56 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
A pox on all of you.

Internet tough guy.

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rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #57 
U Dub - I went with pox  over scabies because it sounded more Shakespearian. And he was one tough literarian.
Softball98mom

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Reply with quote  #58 
You show up on the mound at the college level with a mask, you are going to be seen in a specific light.  Hitters will get excited, they will toe up on the plate, they will try to intimidate you.



This is comical, KB at Florida is seen in a specific light alright! That light is bad ass! And she has the ERA to prove it.
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #59 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Softball_rules5


Wrong, ASA requires them for all levels including Gold

Gold is 18 and under, no? That's why I said, with some exceptions, since a player could technically be playing 18u and be 19.
spazsdad

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Reply with quote  #60 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Softball98mom
You show up on the mound at the college level with a mask, you are going to be seen in a specific light.  Hitters will get excited, they will toe up on the plate, they will try to intimidate you.



This is comical, KB at Florida is seen in a specific light alright! That light is bad ass! And she has the ERA to prove it.

For every Barnhill there are at least 100 pitchers that don't have the command of an elite pitcher so hardly a fair comparison
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