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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #1 
"I'm not going to give 11 million people amnesty and hope my colleagues give us comprehensive reform"  Lindsay Graham.

Maybe not direct quote, but close enough.
woody

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Reply with quote  #2 
Oh, he will give amnesty all right. Watch what makes it to the Senate floor. If it benefits the Dems through increased immigration, and the COC by keeping cheap legal and illegal labor flowing, he will vote for it.
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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #3 
He just said they would get to stay and there would be a border wall.

Pretty close to what Trump said last week.
TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #4 
Not going to shut down the government
Not going to end without a wall
Not going to send 700,000 kids back

Graham is preaching

"not going to get done with people that have an irrational view on how to get an immigration deal done"

His overarching view is that something changed between 10 and 12 - someone got to Trump
woody

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Reply with quote  #5 
Graham will not vote to end immigration. He gets his money from people that benefit from low wage legal and illegal immigrants. He is an eGOP RINO. He detests Trump and Trump voters, and all things Tea Party. He will do anything, say anything to maintain his grip on his political, and monetary power. He doesn't give a crap about American workers, nor what is best for our nation. After his constant hating on Trump, why would anybody believe he would further Trump's agenda?
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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #6 
They ALL get money from all of this, Trump included.

He basically said they brought a deal that Trump said he would sign, and then he wouldn't sign it.

We aren't going to deport these kids - common sense.
Get border security out of it and it would be a win for the President.
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #7 
Deporting kids is not what broke deal and you know it.

Protecting dem demanded quotas from failed socialist states is what broke down the deal. 

Let's see how it plays out.  Graham is anxious to sign off on a deal, even with the dems quota, to avoid MSM wrath.  Trump feels he can win on this issue in the court of public opinion. 

Looks like we are going to get a chance to find out who is right.

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uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #8 
Oh and dems actually came to the table with extremely firm terms.  sh1thole quotas, and no wall.   That would have been a full capitulation.  Nothing won. 

It would be dumb to cave to that position.  You are much better served seeing if the American people back you, or want to follow the noise that the MSM is going to generate.  You have nothing too lose as they gave you nothing.   As they say "Let's see what happens"

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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #9 
Quote:
Originally Posted by uwApoligist
Deporting kids is not what broke deal and you know it.  Never said it did.  Reading comprehension is a must in a civilized debate. Was just quoting Graham.  

Protecting dem demanded quotas from failed socialist states is what broke down the deal. Agreed

Let's see how it plays out.  Graham is anxious to sign off on a deal, even with the dems quota, to avoid MSM wrath.  Trump feels he can win on this issue in the court of public opinion. Agreed - He was just quoting what Trump said.

Looks like we are going to get a chance to find out who is right.  Neither side is right - just gray.
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #10 
Agree neither side is right, just gray.

Graham position (feel free to correct me if I am wrong) is that he feels dems will give him/trump the wall if they give them sh1thole quotas.  So he just wants to give them the quotas, and assume he gets the wall, to be done with it all.  

Trumps position is dems have not given anything.  They are demanded sh1thole quotas and no wall. 

To that we answer no.  Everybody runs to the media.

Dems start with cheap shots, claim Trump said sh1thole.  That falls flat on 2 accounts.  Likely trump never used that term in that fashion, and those countries are failed socialist sh1tholes. 

Now the ball is in Trumps court.  He is laying the claim that dems are willing to deny our military the proper funding to get their sh1thole quotas.  There is an "and no wall", but trump is purposely leaving that out to make this about sh1thole quotas. 

If Trump gets that thinking to stick, Dems are in trouble on this one.  They will need their version of Graham, that senator that can frame their defeat as a win.


 




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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #11 
that's how I read it.  I also understood that President Trump would sign a deal if they brought it to them.

He's not going to get the wall funding without giving up something - just a matter of how much you give up.  Graham's rant on "how does it end" is classic.

Not going to end in a gvt. shutdown
Not going to throw 700,000 kids to the wolves
Going to get border security
Will_I_Wynn

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Reply with quote  #12 
I hear mixed messages.  If a DACA agreement plays well for Trump, how does the deportation of the 39 year old father who has been here since age 10 play?  Do Trump supporters want to deport those who were brought here as children or not?
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A gullible nation is a vulnerable nation.  Challenge what you read on the internet.  Our nation's security is in our hands.  Don't be duped by misinformation.

The Right in here are quoting posts and changing words.  Please search for original post if accurate information is desired.  Also, claims I moderate this discussion forum are untrue.

Obama voted best job as President during our lifetime.

     "In these times, I believe that social media has become evil."
Not sure we must blanket all social media but when anonymous adults attack other anonymous adults on the internet, one has to wonder what chance our kids have.

 Trump should be honest with the American people.


Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #13 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_I_Wynn
I hear mixed messages.  If a DACA agreement plays well for Trump, how does the deportation of the 39 year old father who has been here since age 10 play?  Do Trump supporters want to deport those who were brought here as children or not?



Guess you missed he was ordered deported under Obama twice, but never showed up. He was finally apprehended and deported. 

How again was this something to do with Trump?

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If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


Will_I_Wynn

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Reply with quote  #14 
ICE agents were doing their job back in 2009.  The Obama Administration saved the man with extensions.  Did Trump supporters want this Administration to offer this man an extension?

http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/16/us/detroit-man-deported-after-30-years-cuomo-prime-time-cnntv/index.html

__________________
A gullible nation is a vulnerable nation.  Challenge what you read on the internet.  Our nation's security is in our hands.  Don't be duped by misinformation.

The Right in here are quoting posts and changing words.  Please search for original post if accurate information is desired.  Also, claims I moderate this discussion forum are untrue.

Obama voted best job as President during our lifetime.

     "In these times, I believe that social media has become evil."
Not sure we must blanket all social media but when anonymous adults attack other anonymous adults on the internet, one has to wonder what chance our kids have.

 Trump should be honest with the American people.


Will_I_Wynn

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Posts: 3,972
Reply with quote  #15 
Either Trump supporters wanted this 39 year old father to get an extension or they didn't.  Where do you think these Trump folks stand?
__________________
A gullible nation is a vulnerable nation.  Challenge what you read on the internet.  Our nation's security is in our hands.  Don't be duped by misinformation.

The Right in here are quoting posts and changing words.  Please search for original post if accurate information is desired.  Also, claims I moderate this discussion forum are untrue.

Obama voted best job as President during our lifetime.

     "In these times, I believe that social media has become evil."
Not sure we must blanket all social media but when anonymous adults attack other anonymous adults on the internet, one has to wonder what chance our kids have.

 Trump should be honest with the American people.


woody

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Posts: 10,828
Reply with quote  #16 
Why not just open up the border, and airports, and let anyone come and go as they please? That's essentially what you are advocating.
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Ignorance is forgivable, and correctable with proper study. Stupidity is a way of life.


Will_I_Wynn

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Reply with quote  #17 
Almost nobody supports open borders.  That's a red herring to help the Right avoid dealing with immigration reform.  Do you wish this father just deported would have been given an extension?
__________________
A gullible nation is a vulnerable nation.  Challenge what you read on the internet.  Our nation's security is in our hands.  Don't be duped by misinformation.

The Right in here are quoting posts and changing words.  Please search for original post if accurate information is desired.  Also, claims I moderate this discussion forum are untrue.

Obama voted best job as President during our lifetime.

     "In these times, I believe that social media has become evil."
Not sure we must blanket all social media but when anonymous adults attack other anonymous adults on the internet, one has to wonder what chance our kids have.

 Trump should be honest with the American people.


Lost_1

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Posts: 3,515
Reply with quote  #18 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_I_Wynn
Almost nobody supports open borders.  That's a red herring to help the Right avoid dealing with immigration reform.  Do you wish this father just deported would have been given an extension?



Don't do the crime if you can't do the time

__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #19 
You can pick this apart all you want.   Find an odd case.  Try to make it be all about that one off case.  

We have 1.3 million people, approx., that could show up for dreamer program.  Only 800k actually are in the program.  Officially the other 500k, which this gentleman is a part of here are here illegally.  Given his previous attempted deportations it should come as zero surprise to him if we were to deport him.

Even the 800k that are actually in the dreamer program, each and every one of them have told, endlessly that program is at it's best temporary.  That they need to use their temporary legal status (not naturalized) to go through the naturalization process. 

The DACA, temporary, renewable legal status that the Dems put these people into is the ultimate source of the problem.  Dems were told this when they did it, but seem not to care. 

Now let's talk about what is really needed.  Reasonable border security and reasonable application of our immigration laws.  That is what ultimately will protect our lower wage workers from the constant onslaught driven by the democrat party.  

If we were able to achieve reasonable progress on border security (wall included), I have no problem helping the dreamers achieve a more reasonable longer term situation.  Not blanket Amnesty, but reasonable pathway to citizenship.

Of course none of that helps this guy, as he is here illegally and remains in fully illegal status.  So no joy for him. 

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woody

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Reply with quote  #20 
Buh Bye illegals. Everify would do more than 10,000 ICE agents.
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Will_I_Wynn

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Reply with quote  #21 
Not making this about anything.  Just want to know if Trump supporters wanted this father to get an extension.  Yes or no?  If nobody cares to answer, I'll offer up my guess.

I say no, they didn't want this man or any other illegal immigrant to get an extension.  This is also why I believe a DACA agreement will probably not help Republicans in November.  It's a tough call because "Republicans" doesn't accurately reflect the Right.  A DACA agreement would definitely be frowned upon by Trump supporters while established Republicans would probably find an agreement to be positive.  Who is in the majority would be the next question.

__________________
A gullible nation is a vulnerable nation.  Challenge what you read on the internet.  Our nation's security is in our hands.  Don't be duped by misinformation.

The Right in here are quoting posts and changing words.  Please search for original post if accurate information is desired.  Also, claims I moderate this discussion forum are untrue.

Obama voted best job as President during our lifetime.

     "In these times, I believe that social media has become evil."
Not sure we must blanket all social media but when anonymous adults attack other anonymous adults on the internet, one has to wonder what chance our kids have.

 Trump should be honest with the American people.


TheNarrator

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Posts: 7,831
Reply with quote  #22 
I would not want to see this man deported, IF he has no criminal record and has a job.  It seems the family could have done more on the front end.  I am assuming there is more to the story than is being reported.

If he and his wife are legally married, he has these options:

Without the advanced parole option, a DACA recipient or other undocumented immigrant married to a US citizen would need to seek a waiver and then return to his or her origin country for an interview to gain a visa to re-enter the United States. The couple must demonstrate that the US spouse would suffer extreme hardship unless the DACA recipient comes back into the United States.
"It's not easy and it's not cheap," Gandhi said.
Even marriage to a US citizen might not guarantee a smooth path for the immigrant spouse to gain citizenship. Marrying a US citizen would not help if someone:
  • Committed a crime after receiving DACA status.
  • Created fraudulent documents.
  • Misrepresented himself or herself as a citizen.
  • Left the country and re-entered with no other documentation outside of DACA.

http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/12/politics/daca-marriage-option-waiver/index.html
woody

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Reply with quote  #23 
Deport the lawbreaker and as many others as they can round up ASAP. Lets say somebody was dealing Meth next door to you for 30+ years, and got arrested. Would you say it was OK just leave him alone because he had been doing it for so long, or throw him in jail?
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TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #24 
I see your point Woody, but I don't see the issue as cut and dry as that.  He was brought here at age 9 and had no control.  If he is a contributing member of society and no criminal record, I have no problem with him paying a fine and giving legal status.  Never citizenship and no voting.
woody

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Reply with quote  #25 
No, then in another 20 years, we are giving amnesty to another 10 million lawbreakers.
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Ignorance is forgivable, and correctable with proper study. Stupidity is a way of life.


TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #26 
Should have added sealing the border before dealing with those already here.  Stop the leak first, asses those here and make decisions.  If they are contributing to society, get them on the books and have them start paying taxes.
Lost_1

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Reply with quote  #27 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_I_Wynn
Not making this about anything.  Just want to know if Trump supporters wanted this father to get an extension.  Yes or no?  If nobody cares to answer, I'll offer up my guess.

I say no, they didn't want this man or any other illegal immigrant to get an extension.  This is also why I believe a DACA agreement will probably not help Republicans in November.  It's a tough call because "Republicans" doesn't accurately reflect the Right.  A DACA agreement would definitely be frowned upon by Trump supporters while established Republicans would probably find an agreement to be positive.  Who is in the majority would be the next question.





__________________
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. - Dr. Martin Luther King


“Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage.” Winston S. Churchill


woody

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Reply with quote  #28 
The only political party that will benefit will be the Dems, who will jump in front of every camera telling everyone how they were able to make the racist GOP cave in. Add to that, no wall, no Everify, no ban on chain immigration, and a continued immigration lottery. Dems will do this while being the minority party. No consequences from Trumps election, no sit down and shut up, and get in the back you aren't driving anymore. Just a bunch of America hating Dems and RINOS selling out Americans.
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Ignorance is forgivable, and correctable with proper study. Stupidity is a way of life.


TheNarrator

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Reply with quote  #29 
What's your plan?  Shut the government down over DACA and the wall?  Not exactly a winning scenario. 

Coach laid out the benefits to the GOP, and there has to be some compromise.  Sealing the border first and then dealing with those here is not a bad option - about the best we could hope for right now.
uwApoligist

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Reply with quote  #30 
Oh by the way.  Fancy name BS from the Dems further muddied this water.  They should have come up with a 'card' status for these immigrants.  Student Visa, Workers Visa, ... etc. All of our other temporary workers have a card status, which makes it clear that they are subject to that temporary status and it's rules. 
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