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Shadetree

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Reply with quote  #91 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone


The Thunderbolts weren't a pipeline? 

The Bandits were a defacto pipeline for Dean to JMU. The only thing he couldn't recruit from that program was a National Class pitcher. He did recruit a 2017 currently at JMU. She's a competent pitcher and remains to be seen how she will do in the CAA.


Competent anywhere else means dominating in the CAA.  It is all relevant.  Hopefully CAA talent levels will go up as it is pretty low right now.
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #92 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadetree


Competent anywhere else means dominating in the CAA.  It is all relevant.  Hopefully CAA talent levels will go up as it is pretty low right now.


Great point. And Dean will create a big sucking sound as he continues to grab kids who may have gone to the CAA. The entire league will will have enormous parity starting 2019, the year after Good leaves. Should be very competitive.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #93 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_JAD
I would consider the Thunderbolts more of a farm team than a pipeline...
What would be the top 5 impact players in P5 from the Bolts?
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #94 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone


Great point. And Dean will create a big sucking sound as he continues to grab kids who may have gone to the CAA.
Dean's whole world has changed... CAA kids will not be his kids anymore... or is tenure will be short
jayrot

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Reply with quote  #95 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
What would be the top 5 impact players in P5 from the Bolts?


I'll take Reagan Dykes as one, if you want to call her a Bolts player.
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #96 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
Dean's whole world has changed... CAA kids will not be his kids anymore... or is tenure will be short


He's not recruiting a different player. He's only recruiting a different school. As I said before, you could park any number of his previous players @ JMU on his Auburn roster and it would be just another stud roster in the SEC. 

Dean did it moving from Radford to JMU & will do it @ Auburn. Don't be surprised to see him pass on some current Myers recruits everybody thought were the second coming...he will build a culture @ Auburn, he won't continue whatever culture that currently exists. 

That said & to what I think your point is, no doubt he will have some opportunities to recruit kids he couldn't go after before...mostly pitchers though. IMO
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #97 

Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone


He's not recruiting a different player. He's only recruiting a different school. As I said before, you could park any number of his previous players @ JMU on his Auburn roster and it would be just another stud roster in the SEC. 

Agree to disagree... It was a vintage stereotyped team propped up by two, and then one, people in the circle in Ford and Good.

You need more than just that in the SEC, Pac or Big 12.

Hope he sends cash-filled xmas cards to Ford and then, starting in 2018, Good.

Those two kids made him a crapload of money

 

outofzone

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Reply with quote  #98 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns

Agree to disagree... It was a vintage stereotyped team propped up by two, and then one, people in the circle in Ford and Good.

You need more than just that in the SEC, Pac or Big 12.

Hope he sends cash-filled xmas cards to Ford and then, starting in 2018, Good.

Those two kids made him a crapload of money



"Vintage". You have no idea how spot on you are with that...




AtlUmpSteve

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Reply with quote  #99 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
What would be the top 5 impact players in P5 from the Bolts?


I would start with Meghan Gregg.
34sDad

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Reply with quote  #100 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone


There is a monumental difference in the scholarships @ Auburn vs JMU. Yes, both are fully funded programs but, any Athletic Scholarship monies awarded @ Auburn are now guaranteed. CAA Softball players do not enjoy that benefit as the CAA is not in a Power 5 Conference.

As far as "taking" scholarships away from players...define it how you will but in talking to parents/players dating back to his Radford days that's exactly what happened. If you think coaches, in exit interviews, don't have any number of ways of telling a kid their money is being reduced, they won't see the field next season, you won't travel next season, that's naive thinking.  It happens and it's not disputable. Rarely do you hear much of it because what kid/parent will brag about getting money cut. 

He only signed 3 of the original 6 2018 commits so money certainly became 'available' for this class. No doubt he will be taking a hard look at the current roster & each players' scholarship 'deal'. Don't be surprised to see significant changes to that roster this time next year. While nobody but him truly knows what is scholarship capabilities are moving forward, with all this early recruiting and the Myers were knee deep in it, Coach Dean will be doing some major re-evaluations of the current crop of Auburn verbals. Just like with any new coach, don't be surprised when you hear about Dean telling Myers' recruits thanks but no thanks. 


Coaches quickly figured out ways around the guaranteed scholarships.  They can sign the kids for a low dollar amount under the promise of increasing it "when they have money available".  Once the kid is on campus only the money in the NLI is guaranteed.  Even if they follow through, the increases are still year to year and can be taken away.  Another "trick" would be giving a kid a full ride in their NLI and some schools are now putting that in a dollar amount instead of a percentage.  Year two comes along and the kid is still on the same dollar amount except they're at 95% instead of 100%.  Multiply that by the 12 scholarships and Dean and others have lots of money freed up every year.      
lurker123

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Reply with quote  #101 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sballwatcher
So did she commit as a Bandit? I only ask because it was stated that the kids from the Bandits were not really major contributors. If my recalection is correct Good Arnold Alexander (commit prior) Moran Naujokas Were all Bandits. That is 5 of the starting 9


Good was already committed, she wasn't even sure if she wanted to play college ball over volleyball when he had her commit. The rest of the players you mentioned aren't of the caliber that were the stars of the JMU teams and aren't SEC caliber at all.

On scholarships: Dean is going to be honest with the kids and tell them there is no future for them at Auburn, but that is no different than what he did at JMU. And of course he is going to re-evaluate the verbal commits on the books and maybe tell them no. Worry about how he is going to handle this is small potatoes.

Recruiting: He's going to recruit the same type of kid. He recruited Walters, who did some pretty good things at Auburn the past couple years. He definitely had his type, but the talent is going to have to be better than what's been coming to JMU the past two years. 
Still_JAD

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Reply with quote  #102 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
What would be the top 5 impact players in P5 from the Bolts?


Have not kept up with which players from the Bolts have made an impact, but there were 4 or 5 Auburn commits on Bolts 18U Gold team the past couple of years.  I do know a couple of them, Justus Perry and Chardonnay Harris, were from MN and IL and played for the Bolts AFTER committing to Auburn.
Emptynester

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Reply with quote  #103 
All the Bolts 18 Premier kids are committed before joining the team. Some in state, some out of state.
The younger Bolt teams are all local kids that end up trying out for the premier team.
The roster primarily 70/30 local to out of state with many  going to Auburn some to Alabama and Samford or as JAD states will play with the Bolts if going to Auburn. ( pre new coach, who knows now ? )
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #104 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker123


Good was already committed, she wasn't even sure if she wanted to play college ball over volleyball when he had her commit. The rest of the players you mentioned aren't of the caliber that were the stars of the JMU teams and aren't SEC caliber at all.

On scholarships: Dean is going to be honest with the kids and tell them there is no future for them at Auburn, but that is no different than what he did at JMU. And of course he is going to re-evaluate the verbal commits on the books and maybe tell them no. Worry about how he is going to handle this is small potatoes.

Recruiting: He's going to recruit the same type of kid. He recruited Walters, who did some pretty good things at Auburn the past couple years. He definitely had his type, but the talent is going to have to be better than what's been coming to JMU the past two years. 


Lurker, maybe you should've just cut/copy my earlier post. 

As far as Walters...she was an above average HIGH SCHOOL pitcher from Powhatan, VA who went to Radford. She never played for Dean there. Her record @ Radford was a forgettable 25-29 with an ERA over 3. Thank the Myers for her success @ Auburn. 

You say he's going to recruit the same type of kid but in same sentence you say the talent is going to have to be better...so which is it? Why do you think just because it's Auburn the kids are automatically better? And you're sadly mistaken to think the players under Dean the last few years, who beat their fair share of SEC programs, aren't good enough to play at Auburn. He's already verballed a couple of his 'former' JMU recruits to Auburn...pretty sure he'll continue to get the same type of player he's won with every place he's been. He's that good.

Dean will enjoy the oppt to recruit major pitching talent now, that he couldn't get to JMU in the past. That's really the biggest advantage he has now at Auburn...and a bigger paycheck.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #105 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_JAD


Have not kept up with which players from the Bolts have made an impact, but there were 4 or 5 Auburn commits on Bolts 18U Gold team the past couple of years.  I do know a couple of them, Justus Perry and Chardonnay Harris, were from MN and IL and played for the Bolts AFTER committing to Auburn.
Meghan Gregg is an impact player.

Who would be the other four?

tmz

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Reply with quote  #106 
Morgan Nelson
Libby Suggs
Caroline Seitz
Casey Cooper
Megan Gregg
Tamara Statman

That’s enough.
Still_JAD

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Posts: 437
Reply with quote  #107 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmz
Morgan Nelson
Libby Suggs
Caroline Seitz
Casey Cooper
Megan Gregg
Tamara Statman

That’s enough.


Does Courtney Shae count? Ashley Swindle?
fireballroberts

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Reply with quote  #108 
Cooper never played for the bolts. Her 1st year pick up with Gen X Mobile Thrillers for nationals. She played couple years with Sparks out of Huntsville. The one year they didn't make Nationals she picked up and played with Southern Force team out of Georgia. The last year and a half was with the Tenn Fury.

Dusty

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Reply with quote  #109 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker123


Good was already committed, she wasn't even sure if she wanted to play college ball over volleyball when he had her commit. The rest of the players you mentioned aren't of the caliber that were the stars of the JMU teams and aren't SEC caliber at all.

On scholarships: Dean is going to be honest with the kids and tell them there is no future for them at Auburn, but that is no different than what he did at JMU. And of course he is going to re-evaluate the verbal commits on the books and maybe tell them no. Worry about how he is going to handle this is small potatoes.

Recruiting: He's going to recruit the same type of kid. He recruited Walters, who did some pretty good things at Auburn the past couple years. He definitely had his type, but the talent is going to have to be better than what's been coming to JMU the past two years. 


I don't have any firsthand experience with Dean but know several people (mostly walk-ons or getting minimum money) from JMU who would say the exact opposite of him.  He would routinely tell them he'd get them admitted and they would have a chance to compete for playing time but once they got there they'd quickly realize their true role was to create the illusion of competition and to be kept off of another college roster where they might actually have an opportunity.  There likely was some sour grapes, kids and/or their parents thinking they're better than they really are and so forth but I've heard it enough from different people to not dismiss it entirely.  

Inheriting a stud pitcher and getting another one who grew up in your backyard combined with his Bandits connection was good enough to get him to the top of VA/CAA but I don't think for a second the Bandits alone will help much if all the top SE based travel teams are sending players to other SEC schools.  Do the T-Bolts pick up where they left off with Myers and embrace Dean or take a wait and see attitude with him?  AU softball is used to finishing in the top 3 in the SEC so what happens if they finish middle of the pack or lower this year?  Given what's happened there before his arrival he could do a great job coaching and they still finish in the middle of the pack and exit NCAA's early.

I was listening to sports talk radio while driving around the other day where they were talking about Auburn football and they were saying the athletic culture there is such that Malzahn's job is only safe if he's holding the NC trophy at the end of the year.  So cutthroat ruthless softball coach meets cutthroat ruthless AD, should be very interesting to watch.  It usually doesn't go well for a new coach who comes in after the traumatic firing of the previous coach in any sport so that's where my money would be if I were a betting man.
Still_JAD

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Reply with quote  #110 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dusty
I was listening to sports talk radio while driving around the other day where they were talking about Auburn football and they were saying the athletic culture there is such that Malzahn's job is only safe if he's holding the NC trophy at the end of the year.  So cutthroat ruthless softball coach meets cutthroat ruthless AD, should be very interesting to watch.  It usually doesn't go well for a new coach who comes in after the traumatic firing of the previous coach in any sport so that's where my money would be if I were a betting man.


Jay Jacob's has announced he will be stepping down as AD and Auburn is currently seeking his replacement, so I think it is a little unfair to say that the AD is cutthroat and ruthless.  If anything JJ was a patsy, which is one of the factors in him being told to resign.

As for Malzahn, if he had lost to UGA and Alabama this year there would have been a push to replace him, but unless Alabama just beats the brakes off Auburn his job is safe for another year after they kicked UGA's butt last weekend.
lurker123

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Posts: 180
Reply with quote  #111 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dusty


I don't have any firsthand experience with Dean but know several people (mostly walk-ons or getting minimum money) from JMU who would say the exact opposite of him.  He would routinely tell them he'd get them admitted and they would have a chance to compete for playing time but once they got there they'd quickly realize their true role was to create the illusion of competition and to be kept off of another college roster where they might actually have an opportunity.  There likely was some sour grapes, kids and/or their parents thinking they're better than they really are and so forth but I've heard it enough from different people to not dismiss it entirely.  

Inheriting a stud pitcher and getting another one who grew up in your backyard combined with his Bandits connection was good enough to get him to the top of VA/CAA but I don't think for a second the Bandits alone will help much if all the top SE based travel teams are sending players to other SEC schools.  Do the T-Bolts pick up where they left off with Myers and embrace Dean or take a wait and see attitude with him?  AU softball is used to finishing in the top 3 in the SEC so what happens if they finish middle of the pack or lower this year?  Given what's happened there before his arrival he could do a great job coaching and they still finish in the middle of the pack and exit NCAA's early.

I was listening to sports talk radio while driving around the other day where they were talking about Auburn football and they were saying the athletic culture there is such that Malzahn's job is only safe if he's holding the NC trophy at the end of the year.  So cutthroat ruthless softball coach meets cutthroat ruthless AD, should be very interesting to watch.  It usually doesn't go well for a new coach who comes in after the traumatic firing of the previous coach in any sport so that's where my money would be if I were a betting man.



If you're getting walk-on treatment from Coach Dean you know what you're in for. He brings in a lot of kids for competition. If you are a walk-on and you develop into a starter there is going to be money there for you for the next year. If you are a walk-on you should know it is going to be an uphill battle get on the field from Day 1. Too many Student Athletes bet on themselves for whatever reason and then get mad/upset/resentful when they don't get any playing time. This indicative of all schools at all levels not just the one/s under Dean.

Football is more cutthroat than softball because there is big money coming in from it. The pressure is going to be there for Auburn to be near the top of the SEC, but I don't think they are going to overreact if things don't go that way in year 1. And expectations will need to be tied to who they draw home and away on the SEC schedule.

Also the Bandits kids he got weren't the stars on JMU - I think I've already made that point.
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #112 
Megan Good was a Bandit
lurker123

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Reply with quote  #113 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone
Megan Good was a Bandit


She was a bandit because of Dean only. She was very much committed to JMU before she joined them. 
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #114 
Ok, tag your it.
TruDat

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Reply with quote  #115 
If Dean is the stud coach he's reported to be, Auburn should be okay. However, he won't have the pitching that's so much better than the rest of his conference (ie CAA) such that we should see what kind of coach he really is. Auburn will be in the bottom third of the SEC and not get into the NCAA tournament.
Dusty

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Reply with quote  #116 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker123


If you're getting walk-on treatment from Coach Dean you know what you're in for. He brings in a lot of kids for competition. If you are a walk-on and you develop into a starter there is going to be money there for you for the next year. If you are a walk-on you should know it is going to be an uphill battle get on the field from Day 1. Too many Student Athletes bet on themselves for whatever reason and then get mad/upset/resentful when they don't get any playing time. This indicative of all schools at all levels not just the one/s under Dean.

Football is more cutthroat than softball because there is big money coming in from it. The pressure is going to be there for Auburn to be near the top of the SEC, but I don't think they are going to overreact if things don't go that way in year 1. And expectations will need to be tied to who they draw home and away on the SEC schedule.

Also the Bandits kids he got weren't the stars on JMU - I think I've already made that point.


Couldn't agree more, it still amazed me late into his JMU tenure how he still got 30+ sized rosters well after everyone in the mid-Atlantic was aware of his reputation.  I remember asking a travel coach whether I should sign my dd up for a JMU camp and was told that if he didn't know who you were before you got there then you would be treated like Flounder in Animal House when he went to Omega's rush party so we passed.  

To the point of Bandits not being top players at JMU it sounds like Dean would recruit kids like Good and Alexander and then send them to the Bandits in their senior year but couldn't get the top Bandit players he didn't find first to come to JMU.  My point was that even if he starts to get the top Bandit players to come to AU it may not be enough if the top SE travel teams (bolts, impact, etc) don't send their players to AU.

JAD, my bad I meant ruthless, cutthroat Athletic Dept, not Director. 



Still_JAD

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Reply with quote  #117 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruDat
If Dean is the stud coach he's reported to be, Auburn should be okay. However, he won't have the pitching that's so much better than the rest of his conference (ie CAA) such that we should see what kind of coach he really is. Auburn will be in the bottom third of the SEC and not get into the NCAA tournament.


It is easy to win in CAA when you have SEC caliber pitching.  Now the questions become how much did Mickey Dean have to do with developing the talent of his pitchers and how will he do against competition that is on a level playing field from a talent perspective.
Shadetree

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Reply with quote  #118 
For the past 5 years Dean has been a good coach with great pitching that he parlayed into a big buck SEC job. Good for him.  My dad always said if you cant be good be lucky.  Sometimes right place at the right time works out just fine!
lurker123

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Posts: 180
Reply with quote  #119 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TruDat
If Dean is the stud coach he's reported to be, Auburn should be okay. However, he won't have the pitching that's so much better than the rest of his conference (ie CAA) such that we should see what kind of coach he really is. Auburn will be in the bottom third of the SEC and not get into the NCAA tournament.


They will make the tournament because every team in the SEC makes the tournament - it's in the rulebook somewhere [wink]

The SEC standings always shake out weird because it isn't balanced where everyone plays everyone. But it could be rough based on what who we know Auburn will play in conference:

3/9-11 @ LSU
3/16-18 vs. Bama
3/23-25 vs. Kentucky
4/6-8 vs. Tenn 
4/20-22 vs. Arkansas
4/27-29 @ Texas A&M

They'll also play: @ Mizzou and @ Ole Miss

Won't play: USC, UGA, Miss St, Florida
TruDat

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Reply with quote  #120 
As anyone who follows the game might admit, he will not be the big dog in his new conference. In fact, with all the freshmen and no big time pitcher, it will be a struggle. I just don't see him getting this crew to rise above their seemingly low level of competence on paper.
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