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sballwatcher

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Reply with quote  #31 
Now back to the actual topic!

I have seen 2 of the 2020 MI recruits and both are absolute studs! The 2019 Bama P from FL in HUGE and has a huge bat, but I did not see a big improvement over the past couple yrs. Have not seen her a ton, so maybe dead wrong.
The 2020 P from FL is also a big kid and has a lot of potential, would love to see her playing at PGF Nationals this Summer. I believe she was at AS/USA the past few years.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #32 
Seriously.... if you are not at PGF Premier, you head into major P5 with a blindfold on
rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #33 
Lefty - that's why a smart, motivated coach, such as Lotief, can be successful year after year. There's a ton of players that are late developing or not promoted as compared to the stars of Travel Ball teams. Furthermore, parents will take less in order for Lil' Suzie to go to the usual suspect schools. And who's to say - is a NCAA softball championship valued over how much scholarship one got? Hell yeah, people love winners, education be damned (besides a degree ain't worth sh1t these days).
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #34 
Lotief is a great hitting coach, and he got a miracle T5 and a couple of T7s. But the PGF lets you see the greatest pitching out there. And, if he had recruited a pitcher or two in Huntington Beach, they could have done major damage, and maybe won the thing in 2014, or the next year, avoiding that meltdown at Auburn
Emptynester

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Reply with quote  #35 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
Lotief was a great hitting coach, and he got a miracle T5 and two T7s. But the PGF lets you see the greatest pitching out there. And, if he had recruited a pitcher or two in Huntington Beach, they could have done major damage, and maybe won the thing


Agreed
rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #36 
I am certainly no Lotief fan, but... 2008 to 2016 - 7 Super Regional appearances (and a melt down in 2017) is far from a miracle. Then again, championships are won with pitching. Not bad for a non P5 school.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #37 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
I am certainly no Lotief fan, but... 2008 to 2016 - 7 Super Regional appearances (and a melt down in 2017) is far from a miracle. Then again, championships are won with pitching. Not bad for a non P5 school.
No... punched wayyy above his weight.... but my comment about the value of PGF has no such disclaimer
ChinMusic

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Reply with quote  #38 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Softball_rules5


Yeah Beverly bandits, new Lenox lightning, Louisville lady sluggers don’t kids to bigger programs, my bad. Enough, I’m not giving specific coaches names. You’re obviously going to believe what you want. I’ve been through the recruiting process with many kids myself so this isn’t a new subject. So should I now stick out my tongue and take my ball and leave (I’ll beat you to your answer, yes)


How many players from those teams at OU? Ever? Not my first rodeo either cowboy. All I’m saying is it’s not standard operating procedure as has been stated and implied. That’s what I believe because the facts and figures just don’t logically support a belief to the contrary. Don’t really care what you do with your ball.....or your tongue.

uga20

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Reply with quote  #39 
Well I can tell you 1st hand kid from Bandits and Ga Impact are legit... But the question I have is why don’t the Travel ball coaches and parents blow up the college coaches spot when they don’t live up to their promise about scholarship $$$$
sballwatcher

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Reply with quote  #40 
1 word. EGO! They would actually have to admit their kid was not on full ride! 🤣

Here is the post I referred to in earlier post.

http://robocoach.websitetoolbox.com/post/softball-offer-9481498
uga20

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Reply with quote  #41 
Sballwatcher I agree with you 100% but EGO can go to hell,your playing with a kids life when you didn’t have to .... You took a young lady off the market because other colleges really respect the verbal...Early recruitment stinks but it’s part of the game don’t know how you stop it unless you make the Coaches honor it right then and there with a signed paper..The way they want to stop it only going to promote not putting it on instagram and maybe parents won’t wear that certain college shirt at games.😂 Sue Enguist had a good interview on Flo... But it’s on the college coaches to stop not the parents, how can you tell a parent or kid we are not forcing you to committ but the coaches saying we will still recruit your daughter position until they commit...plus the fact we are giving your kid 50%,85% or 💯 %...

https://www.flosoftball.com/video/5627094-sue-enquist-takes-on-early-recruiting
rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #42 
Here's a hard fact - college coaches recruit the parents more vigorously than the player.
sballwatcher

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Reply with quote  #43 
^^^^So true!
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #44 

For most programs, I would say probably true

Elites could not give less of a carp

outofzone

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Reply with quote  #45 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sballwatcher
1 word. their EGO! They would actually have to admit kid was not on full ride! 🤣 Here is the post I referred to in earlier post. http://robocoach.websitetoolbox.com/post/softball-offer-9481498


That I would agree with. I can only recall a few instances where, in talking with parents, their kid wasn't on a "full ride". 

3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #46 
The parents do that, for sure.

Until they are speaking with someone that they know knows better...lol
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #47 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
Here's a hard fact - college coaches recruit the parents more vigorously than the player.


My experience was quite the opposite. Other than the requisite hellos, handshakes & hugs @ travel ball games, the only time we spent any real time with the staff was at the Unofficial & camps. That said, we had multiple choices but our daughter pretty much new where she wanted to go as long as the interest was mutual. Fortunately for us it was.

IMO, parents create this fallacy their kid is being recruited by virtually every top program, and by extension there is a bidding war for her services. EGO now comes into play no doubt. It's certainly easier to parce the attention this way than it is to admit only 1-2 programs have sincere interest. 

I have never heard of a Head Coach/Staff recruiting the parents, so to speak. I guess it does happen but my bet it's the parents that create this false narrative. I'm interested to hear some examples though. 





3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #48 
Quote:
Originally Posted by outofzone


My experience was quite the opposite. Other than the requisite hellos, handshakes & hugs @ travel ball games, the only time we spent any real time with the staff was at the Unofficial & camps. That said, we had multiple choices but our daughter pretty much new where she wanted to go as long as the interest was mutual. Fortunately for us it was.

IMO, parents create this fallacy their kid is being recruited by virtually every top program, and by extension there is a bidding war for her services. EGO now comes into play no doubt. It's certainly easier to parce the attention this way than it is to admit only 1-2 programs have sincere interest. 

I have never heard of a Head Coach/Staff recruiting the parents, so to speak. I guess it does happen but my bet it's the parents that create this false narrative. I'm interested to hear some examples though. 





I agree with this, certainly with P5 programs
rudymartinez

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Reply with quote  #49 
And with that being said Zone, did not those truly interested in your daughter balloon your head with flowery accolades? Face it, 90% + of the time, the players are strongly recommended by the parents as to which school to attend. Convincing the parents is a huge factor in recruiting top level athletes. The worker bees don't get the same attention. 
sballwatcher

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Reply with quote  #50 
I would say it is more observing the parents at tournaments etc. However, if they want a player they will not really care about the parents. Where the parents can come into play is if they are deciding between a couple players. Heard this directly from several different coaches, P5 and other.
Emptynester

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Reply with quote  #51 
Agree with Zone. Many parents brag or try to make those “ helping “ choices for their kids. My daughter is not on a full ride. You can listen to parents talk about their kid , good for them whatever the real situation is. Who cares. My kids choice had much more to do with all factors. No matter offers from a few other schools D1,2or3 , she did not want to stay in state. She wanted to be in a big conference where she feels she can play with competition but had no problem not being at a “ top” program. A school which has top classes in her field of study. Her good grades allowing her to bypass basic classes. I love that my kid has no view of softball past college. She loves the game but it’s a means to an end. She would have attended college either way with help be it through grades or just loans like everyone else. Sports allows help with finances and should be viewed as such, nothing more imo. Play a game you worked hard at to get noticed , get a top quality education and get some financial help with those goals in mind. She and we are grateful either way.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #52 
I don't think that parents are considered in the sense that they may be some sort of pain in the a** to the coaching staff while the kid is in college, but I agree that if there is an off-putting characteristic in the adult that does avail itself in the progeny, maybe, maybe that is a consideration for a lesser-impact position.

I don't believe it is in play at all for a stud pitcher. At that point the coach will go full Christopher-Walken-in-The-Deer-Hunter and see what happens.
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #53 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
And with that being said Zone, did not those truly interested in your daughter balloon your head with flowery accolades? Face it, 90% + of the time, the players are strongly recommended by the parents as to which school to attend. Convincing the parents is a huge factor in recruiting top level athletes. The worker bees don't get the same attention. 


That's a great post Rudy!. Made me chuckle. Truthfully, no flowery accolades BUT, like many parents the attention does make each day a bit warmer. To this day, I still tell my daughter, "Do you know how cool it is to be your Dad". 
outofzone

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Reply with quote  #54 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3leftturns
I don't think that parents are considered in the sense that they may be some sort of pain in the a** to the coaching staff while the kid is in college, but I agree that if there is an off-putting characteristic in the adult that does avail itself in the progeny, maybe, maybe that is a consideration for a lesser-impact position.

I don't believe it is in play at all for a stud pitcher. At that point the coach will go full Christopher-Walken-in-The-Deer-Hunter and see what happens.


Pretty accurate assessment, at least from my experience.
3leftturns

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Reply with quote  #55 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudymartinez
And with that being said Zone, did not those truly interested in your daughter balloon your head with flowery accolades?
Whether it is being pursued by another employment opportunity, or such pursuit of a child by a college or job opportunity, there is gratification.... no doubt
HenryLouisAaron

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Reply with quote  #56 
<< As far as schools doing early verbals and then over recruiting, look no further than the beloved Sooners. >> (Softball rules5)

<< It is widely known that OK, and many others, have sent NLIs of much lesser $ values than what was verbally committed too. They might have 6 kids verbally committed at 100% when they only can really only give 3 at 100%. When NLI day comes 2 of those kids get 100% NLI and they other 4 get NLIs with 25%........just a hypothetical example. >> (sballwatcher)

<< I’ve heard at OK it’s much more rampant than that. Have heard stories of cranking 10 kids in a class for 5 spots. Signing day comes and the NLI is 10% and now the kid is screwed. Probably happpens other places but have heard it’s the norm in Norman. >> (Softball rules5)

================================================

<< It does happen and happens a lot all around the country. I have personally seen it happen to kids at Big 12, Big 10, SEC, Big 10, and even a MAC school. Granted the MAC coach moved on to a bigger conference leaving the next coach to deal with the "overspending." You will not hear about it much from parents/players because of ego, egos, and more egos. There was a post on this site in the Fall about this very thing happening. Their NLI was a joke compared to offer....according to poster. >> (sballwatcher)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I am not saying that it doesn't happen (I believe it does). 
But I do not believe that Oklahoma deserves to seen as some sort of poster child for this type of behavior (as in Softball rules5 stating "it's the norm in Norman").

I would love to hear any statements from the actual parents of players who visit this site (or from the players themselves) with info on any such coaching staff behavior of this type from Oklahoma. Please step forward and let us know.

And anyone else who has any such info on any of the other well known top level schools... please tell us exactly which schools did exactly what in regard to the promises that were made to your daughters - and then not kept.

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