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ItsAGame

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Reply with quote  #1 
I know a lot of you think JC is a joke and anyone that plays there probably wasnt good enough in the first place to play anywhere else, but I need some info to pass on to DD.

She was recruited elsewhere, but decided to go JC and get all her basic stuff out of the way for very little out of pocket and still be able to play instead of sitting for 2 years. She is a freshman and has been told she will be starting in the spring. She is VERY happy with her decision, even though the other schools were a lot closer to home than where she is.

The info I need to pass on is NOW WHAT? Where does she need to go from here and is it basically the same as in high school, i.e send letters, talk to coaches, send schedules etc.  Does she need to start now, or wait till spring, even tho the 4yr coaches will be busy with their own team in the spring? What does she need to find out as to the transferring of classes, etc. 

Oh yeah, she is still 18 and will playing summer ball on a travel team, although it isnt one of the top tier teams or GOLD. She has had enough of the stress and hassle of that and wants to have FUN her last year of playing after 9 years of driving at least 2hrs to practices and running all over the country. Now, before she gets berated for doing that; she is not looking to play at one of the top 25 schools, she just wants to finish at a 4yr school, get her degree and continue playing a sport she loves.

Thanks for the information

TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #2 
Going to a JC first has nothing to be ashamed of.
There are many talented players that are more comfortable going to a JC first and then deciding which 4 yr college to choose.
Many JC players have done great after transferring to a 4 yr university.
I think that if a student does not know what he or she wants to study, it is more advisable to go to a JC and then go to a 4 yr one.
There are a few JC's in SoCal that have very high standard and one does not loose anything by going to them.
JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #3 
I cannot conceive of anyone thinking that attending a JC is "a joke". It is simply an alternative means to an education and opportunity to play softball if that figures into the equation. For some it is a viable financial means and for others an opportunity to prepare for the rigors of a 4 year institution, both academically and athletically. Hardly a "joke". More like a challenge and an opportunity.
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"Freethinkers are those who are willing to use their minds without prejudice and without fearing to understand things that clash with their own customs, privileges, or beliefs. This state of mind is not common, but it is essential for right thinking. Where it is absent discussion is apt to become worse than useless." Leo Tolstoy

"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
MHSDad2009

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Reply with quote  #4 
Chelsey Mesa, Crystl Bustos, so many others...they're no joke and neither is JC.

Congrats on you and your DD knowing what's right for her and having the conviction to follow your/her own decisions.

That willingness to do what's right for her, rather than her ego or what others may think is right, is the one value that will last her beyond college and well into her career and life.

Best of luck to her!


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gosaints

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Reply with quote  #5 
Itsagame:
My DD is a senior and is strongly considering the JUCO route also.  She has several attractive offers on the table from D2 & NAIA schools but doesn't know what the heck she wants to major in and eventually would still like to  attend a major university and play ball.  May never happen, but she knows that going the JUCO route (vs. a smaller 4 year program immediately) will not eliminate that possibility nor make it more difficult later.

The JUCO coach will help your DD will help her with exposure.  She can make contact / keep 4 year colleges updated on her own just as she did in high school.  She should probably clear it through her JUCO coach to make sure there are no rules violations involved (shouldn't be...but always a good idea to check).  Assuming it's a competitive JUCO program, a lot of that exposure comes in Fall ball where the JUCO's will schedule to play a lot of 4 year programs.  If the ones they typically schedule aren't of interest to your DD, then she can certainly make her JUCO coach aware of her interests.  Assuming she performs well,  then her JUCO coach is going to be her best advocate for her recruitment at the 4 year program.  I know of some JUCO coaches that will try and line up a game in the Fall against teams that their players are interested in (assuming it's within proximity and workable). 
Original_Coach

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Reply with quote  #6 

Make sure she communicates clearly to her Junior College coaches what her desires are for a four year school. Her JC coaches should be very aggressive with assisting her in her placement to a four year school! Best Wishes!


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TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #7 
It also helps if the JC coach has worked at a D1 program, as she or he know what to do to get to a D1 school.
The Best JC in SoCal right now is Mt Sac.Not only because they have won so many California JC championship, but also because their coach is well known in D1 softball circle.
coachfrank

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Reply with quote  #8 
Two thoughts:  First, my daughter originally enrolled in a junior college in our home town in nor cal, then took an opportunity to play NAIA in so cal at semester. Should have known even a few hundred miles was too far from home for her (youngest is quite happy in NY), especially not knowing what she wanted to study.

Now I am an assistant coach at that same JC and we have 3 players with the skills to play mid-level D1 ball, but for similar reasons, they chose to stay close to home.

The point is, there's no rush, nor disgrace, in JC ball. It's an opportunity to play at a decent to very good level and save a few bucks on school. Some people just need a little more time to untie the apron strings.
ItsAGame

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Reply with quote  #9 
thanks for all the responses, they are very encouraging and helpful.

She is not sure where she would like to finish out her education so that is one thing she will have to seriously do some thinking on before she starts communicating w/4yr coaches. Heck, she's already changed her mind on a major and she hasnt been at school for a full semester.

Like I said she was recruited by several schools even tho we didnt start any marketing until her junior summer (no one told us that she should start in grade school, lol) Her Gold coach told her she has the ability to play D1, but of course, all money was used.  We weighed her options and looking at it financially and socially, she made the right decision
She is from a small school in midwest so a major college was frightening at the least.

We will try to get a video made this spring to send coaches over the summer and send them her schedule.  Hopefully, we will find the right fit again.

If anyone knows of a school that will be needing a second baseman in a couple of years that takes JC tranfers, let me know.  If she can find the right fit, it doesnt matter what part of country it is.

As for the apron strings being cut , this school is 4 hrs away, so that didnt even figure in the decision.
sunsfam

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Reply with quote  #10 
http://www.sellsports.com/collegei.htm

here is a link to state-by-state college programs

some jc college coaches have "feeder" relationships with four-year programs, where they are on the "same page" as far as how they approach their program, fundamentals, conditioning, etc...

but if u want to do some of the leg work yourself, pull up rosters, check your position, # of players at your position and their year...see if they have "tr" transfers on their rosters, check the .edu part of the site and see if they offer your major, look at the graduate school too...

read the archives and bios, see if the ones playing your position have any career-ending injuries or "are doubtful" or the other way, if they have a bunch of injured players coming back, no room at the inn

my dd had a mentor that got into some trouble when she transfered because she did not have enough hours toward a declared major, or something like that??? she wasn't eligible until christmas

what is your major, i hear nursing and some majors are dang difficult to do with softball...that there is that decision to make, whether to continue on in softball or not...i think it has to do with labs and practicals, etc...if u do continue playing softball, perhaps u are also making a commitment to five years for your undergrad...

lots of decisions...ahhh to be young : )

make sure u take a look at the coaches' bios also, some have coached JC or even high school...some come from a school u have interest in or part of the country...find a connection and work it

let the coaches know something about u, if u have family in the area...how serious u are about your field of study...not sure if it helps but IMHO if u show a coach there is "more than one reason" u are coming to their school..they may find one of those 14-22 roster spots for u

the invited walk-on is a real thing...if u are willing   let them know u are coming, what u do, where u play...it may not be as exciting as getting a "full ride scholarship" but to have a college coach say they have a spot for u and look forward to u joining the team...is still a darn cool event in a young life

...college programs always need base runners and bull pen catchers, sometimes an injury or grade problem opens up a roster spot

good luck...play ball




JackiesCoach

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Reply with quote  #11 

Going to a JC is not a "joke" however it does have academic stigma.  For example, the question may be asked if the individual had the academic ability to go to a university why not.  I can tell you in a field of analyzing academic qualifications there is an academic stigma to JC. Alot of JCs are stereotyped as the 13th and 14th grade and supposedly do not provide a university growing experience.  Not necessarily true.

rocklifter

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Reply with quote  #12 
Our situation was quite different in that my daughter has the grades and SAT scores to go to a 4 year school now. But a few of the schools she was interested in thought she needed a year of JuCo to help her with ball. She lost quite a bit of exposure due to a family death last summer. Additionally she completely changed her swing and even though its there...we all thought she needed to play instead of being Red Shirted....

Thus the Juco..

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TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #13 
Keep in mind that not all JC's have great softball programs or great coaches.
In SoCal we are lucky to have many JC's with great softball programs and great coaches.
JoiseyGuy

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Reply with quote  #14 
Hammer - Sounds a lot like Florida to me.
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"Freethinkers are those who are willing to use their minds without prejudice and without fearing to understand things that clash with their own customs, privileges, or beliefs. This state of mind is not common, but it is essential for right thinking. Where it is absent discussion is apt to become worse than useless." Leo Tolstoy

"Do not try to teach pigs to sing. It will frustrate you and infuriate the pigs who will unite in anger against you, and you will never achieve singing your song". Dr. Petersen
ItsAGame

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Posts: 11
Reply with quote  #15 
I just wanted to clear up something- dd DID NOT choose JC because she did not have the test scores or grades to get into a 4-yr school; in fact, she applied to several both public and private (D1, D2 and NAIA)and got accepted to ALL of them. But, since no-one told us that we had to start the recruiting process 10 years ago, all athletic money was used by the time we got around to talking to coaches and since the academic assistance didnt quite cover what she needed, she decided to go another route--

ex:  4yr college tuition and books per yr - approx 7,000 (or more at the private schools); whereas, she had a state tuition money program that  she had completed requirements for that paid ALL the tuition at JC, plus the school came up with ALL books and although couldnt help w/housing the first semester (which was okay) has now come up w/75% housing for second semester. So, as we layed the options in front of her, it didnt take her long to figure out that this JC was going to cost her about 1800.00 for the entire year versus 15,000.00 for the closer private school that offered her 50% tuition/housing. And she will be taking basically the same classes as she would at a 4yr for the first two years.

We need to know what she needs to do now to be able to continue to play after she graduates JC and furthers her education at a 4 yr.  And who knows what 2 yrs will bring, she may decide that she never wants to see another softball as long as she lives, but we are glad that she has an opportunity to play a sport she has loved since she was 5 , all the while getting an education to go along with it.

Thanks for your help.
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #16 
First and foremost the student has to decide as soon as possible what major she wants to study and which university is the Best for that subject.
Then she has to get the classes needed for that specific subject, so that when she goes to the 4 yr school she would not need to take more classes than necessary.
Second she has to let the softball coach know about her decision and have the coach talk to the coach of her preferential university.
Then last she would need to study hard and play hard.
JackiesCoach

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Reply with quote  #17 
itsagame. your statement"And she will be taking basically the same classes as she would at a 4yr for the first two years." is not true.  Classes at JC's are typically taught by masters level instructors, most 4yr institutions have ph.d level instructors for freshman english, maths, and sciences.  it is not the same.



NFSentinel

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Reply with quote  #18 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JackiesCoach
itsagame. your statement"And she will be taking basically the same classes as she would at a 4yr for the first two years." is not true.  Classes at JC's are typically taught by masters level instructors, most 4yr institutions have ph.d level instructors for freshman english, maths, and sciences.  it is not the same.



You are correct. It isn't the same. According to a recent study, those masters degree instructors are preparing their students better, than those PhD's that are teaching at the 4 year. On average, 2 year transfer students are doing better in year 3 at the schools they transfer into, than the native students that had been their since high school graduation.

PhD does not = superior!
LeftField

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Reply with quote  #19 

Actually at a number of larger D1 schools, freshman classes are taught by TA's (Grad Students / Teaching Assistants) in an intimate assembly hall setting containing over 100 fellow students.

JackiesCoach

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Reply with quote  #20 
LF and NF as I said earlier, going to JC is not a joke but it is not the same as going to a four year university. The extreme example is the freshman english class at Harvard/Yale/Princeton is not the same as the freshman english class at community college.  just not the same guys.  not a joke but not the same.  Very few students with high gpa's and high sat (90
+percentile) scores will start at JC. 
rocklifter

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Reply with quote  #21 

I will disagree and let me explain. Lets say a kid didnt get recruited and yet still wanted to try and get noticed at a Top 25 D1 program. Why not try JuCo? You going to say that she wouldnt be taken seriously if she doesnt go onto a 4 year school even if she does have the grades? Additionally from what I have heard there are more kids going this route to get a leg up on things and maybe getting exposed where they missed out otherwise.....
This may be a kid that wants both....a good education and yet want to be on that team.....
You going to dismiss her wants and dreams?

JackiesCoach?
I will disagree again on some of your assumptions....
#1...I went to a University where most of the Freshman and Sophmore level classes were taught by GA's or someone with a recent PhD. Some masters level teachers I know here in Georgia that teach at A Juco have many years of experience and in actuality a much better teacher than someone with a PhD. Having a degree doesnt allow one to be a better instructor right away, just like it doesnt mean a hill of beans if someone was an All  Star in a certain sport. Doesnt give them a magic pill to teach/coach and be excellent at it.

I have taught at both a University and at a Juco. I can safely say that overall the experiences and expectations were the same at both schools. If these are State/Fed funded schools your not going to find much difference in the approach or requirements...The level of teaching in some instances may be better at an Institution that hires Masters Level teachers than ones with an ABD...


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playa

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Reply with quote  #22 
I just can't stay outa this one any longer we all know that we will take that JC summer course we'd never of passed in our own university praying for a 'pass' & why is that because JC courses are so rigorous?
rocklifter

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Reply with quote  #23 
I dont recall saying all JC's were difficult and held a higher standard for academics. I am merely speaking from what I know Playa....

Personal experience for a second here....
I had problems with Chemistry...it was killing me and I dropped the class at the University of Georgia...That summer I went to a JC in the Atlanta area to take this course with the mindset that I would fly through it like knife through butter....Didnt happen.
My instructor was a retired Chemist from Dow Chemical and was even harder than the Chem classes at Georgia. How did I pass? I cut the ladies yard, washed her car, and basically lived at her house to get tutoring for the dang class....
I kissed the ground when I passed....

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TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #24 
Come on guys Chemistry is a very interesting class, specially the lab.
Had an Eastern European lady as our Lab teacher, more problem than the class itself.The most strict teacher I had ever seen.
So what you are saying is that us Chemical Engineers are Nerd ?????
TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #25 
Actually you are very right.
Guess what I  also have graduated from a Bar tending School as I had planned to purchase a grand Old Bar, but was outbid by two other people.

rocklifter

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Reply with quote  #26 
Hammer Chem engineers scare me.......
Well so does Accountants like my wife....Math Nerds...

Course I cant say anything with a PhD in Exercise Science...
Athletic Nerd then.....HA HA HA HA

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TheHammer

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Reply with quote  #27 
rocklifter don't worry Nerds are IN.

dthomas440

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Reply with quote  #28 
JC colleges need good players.
They do provide exposure in tournaments. Other JC coaches take notice.
I was at the NFCA convention and there were quite a few JC coaches there getting information but also making those very important contacts for their kids.


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Mon

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Reply with quote  #29 

I go to a JC school (El Camino) and I am trying out for the team for 2008 season. I want to play one year at my school and then play at a university for 3 years. I know that UC's all have walk on tryouts (a specific date is usually set for that), so your DD may have to walk on. I hear that there are recruiters from different schools coming to games and watching the girls play. There were 2 girls at my school last year that got recruited. One of them did not really like the school that they were recruited for, so she is playing this year as well and then will play at a UC. The other one got recruited to boston college.

Themefakedet

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Reply with quote  #30 
Quote:
And she will be taking basically the same classes as she would at a 4yr for the first two years." is not true.  Classes at JC's are typically taught by masters level instructors, most 4yr institutions have ph.d level instructors for freshman English, maths, and sciences.  it is not the same.


Jackie's coach: your suggestion that JC classes are somewhat inferior as compared to a 4  year-- I can't speak for  the country on a whole, but for California --you are absolutely wrong.  Oftentimes professors in the 4 years look at teaching as a burden, something to do and get over with so they can spend their time on their real interests: research and publication; for the JC's in California anyway, the mission IS teaching; faculty receive training and professional development related to teaching...it's not enough to know your subject,  you have to know how to teach it. How to teach it....not something the 4 years concentrate on.

 In California the minimum requirement to teach in a JC is a master's, but many if not most instructors have doctorates.  The JC's are a haven for  PH.D s who want to teach, and more often than not outnumber their MA level colleagues. In addition, just read a comparative study on under-graduate courses: students report remembering better classes (less boring, more active) from the JC, not the 4 year.  If you are someone's coach you ought to know your facts before you tarnish the JC pathway to the degree. 
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